HL Deb 24 January 1963 vol 246 cc144-6

2.38 p.m.

LORD STONHAM

My Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.

[The Question was as follows:

To ask Her Majesty's Government whether they are now in a position to give a decision on the Parrett Relief Channel Scheme submitted by the Somerset River Board in June, 1961.]

LORD ST. OSWALD

My Lords, this is a large and expensive scheme, over £1 million being involved, and the Board's rate of grant is 80 per cent. We must consider schemes of this magnitude with care. There have been discussions between the Ministry's engineers, the river board engineers, and the river board's consultants about the possibility of a cheaper scheme. The Ministry's technical officers are now preparing a report assessing the benefits the proposals would bring to the land, and this report should be available next month. We shall then conclude our examination of the proposals as quickly as possible, and as soon as the position is clear, we will notify the river board of our decision. I ought in fairness to say that this is a scheme where it is not proving easy to show that the benefits match the cost of the scheme submitted by the river board.

LORD STONHAM

My Lords, while thanking the noble Lord for that very helpful reply, is it not the case that the Economic Secretary to the Treasury led the deputation which he himself received and there ought not, therefore, to be any difficulty about the money? Is the noble Lord not aware that, for £30 an acre, 30,000 acres of land in the Langport area, which have for centuries been virtually derelict because of the long and serious floods which occur every winter, would be made fertile; and that the scheme would earn its cost in three or four years? Surely it is an inordinate length of time for the Minister to take over eighteen months before making a decision. Cannot it be hurried up?

LORD ST. OSWALD

My Lords, it is quite true to say that the area of land is 31,000 acres, but whether the noble Lord's calculations are correct that this large sum expended would be earned in three to four years I beg leave to doubt, until perhaps I have discussed the matter with him. I have not seen any reasoning, or any calculations, which would lead to that deduction. Naturally, I treat every suggestion of the noble Lord with respect, and if he would offer me figures to prove his case, I will gladly receive them. Possibly we can then consider it on the basis of his figures.

LORD STONHAM

My Lords, I will most certainly give the noble Lord my figures, but would he take into account one other aspect? His Department has approved the building of three pumping stations which are now being constructed and on which pumping will have to stop if this channel is not constructed, because it would only accentuate the flooding. In other words, his Department has agreed to pay for half the charge. Surely it is only common sense and economy now to agree to pay the other half so that this land and the houses there can be kept flood-free.

LORD ST. OSWALD

My Lords, I have not been advised of that fact, but rather than tell the noble Lord he is wrong I will study what he has said and confer with him also on that, if I may.

LORD STONHAM

My Lords, I quite accept what the noble Lord has said. I can only say that I am astonished that the Economic Secretary to the Treasury did not present those facts to him. It is obvious that the National Farmers' Union have briefed me a great deal better than they did him.

LORD OGMORE

My Lords, is this not rather an extraordinary situation for the House to be faced with? The noble Lord, Lord St. Oswald, has refused the figures of the noble Lord, Lord Stonham. Have not the Govern- ment their own estimate of how long it would take to amortise this particular scheme; and, if so, cannot they give their figures to the House?

LORD ST. OSWALD

The noble Lord will forgive me, but far from not accepting the noble Lord's figures, no figures were given to me to accept. I said I would study any figures he did give me. Naturally, these things are very difficult to work out. They are of infinite complexity and we are in the situation of handling taxpayers' money. All these things have to be studied with great care with that in view.

VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLSBOROUGH

My Lords, might I urge the noble Lord to do something more urgent about this? I am a Somerset man, and I know every village and hamlet in the area adjacent to this place. Every year there are floods there. Every summer, if you get anything like clear weather, the fertility and produce of the land is obvious. What you really want is to bring it into proper alignment with similar land. It is a wonderful area for agricultural cultivation. Do let us do something about it.

LORD ST. OSWALD

My Lords, as to the time which has been taken in considering this scheme, I would agree with the noble Viscount that there is no reason to be happy about it and we are now doing our best to reach a conclusion; but we shall have to reach a conclusion with regard to the best use of national resources, and this, I think, is what he himself would wish.