HL Deb 29 May 1962 vol 241 cc180-7

7.8 p.m.

Order of the Day for the Second Reading read.

VISCOUNT FURNESS

My Lords, I rise to move that this Bill be now read a second time. At this late hour I do not propose to detain your Lordships for long over this small, but nevertheless important, Bill, but I feel that I should be failing in my duty to your Lordships if I did not explain the situation, as succinctly as I can, to the House. The general law regarding the hours of opening of shops will be familiar to your Lordships. It is found in Part I of the Shops Act, 1950, and generally provides that all retail shops must be closed from early evening and on the afternoon of one day a week, known as "early closing day." There are certain exemptions to this general law, notably for the purchase of meals and refreshments, tobacco, newspapers and magazines, and medicines.

However, the needs of international airports are different. They work round the clock and, indeed, frequently they are busier at night than by day. This fact attracted the attention of the Select Committee on Estimates, who said, in their Fifth Report, 1960–61, at paragraph 84, that The hours of opening of shops at the airport"— this is dealing with Heathrow in particular— are regulated by the Shops Act, and passengers using a major international airport are frequently inconvenienced and irritated when shops are closed. It was argued by the Ministry that 'the cost of overtime for staff and so on might make it so much more expensive to run the shops [for 24 hours a day] that our percentage commission would be lessened'. Your Committee cannot believe that a 'skeleton service' of shops would make a loss if operated throughout the 24 hours during the peak periods in the summer. They believe that there would be a very considerable demand for them, particularly since the cheap night fares are becoming so popular with travellers. … They therefore recommend that there should be an immediate examination of the financial prospects of extending the hours of opening for certain shops at Heathrow. The Minister accepted that recommendation and stated in the Fifth Special Report from the Estimates Committee that: The Minister wishes to provide the best possible facilities for the travelling public and to bring additional profitable trade to the airport. The judgment of the operators of the shops, i.e., the concessionaires, as to the financial prospects of extended hours of opening must also be taken into account. No doubt many of your Lordships have taken advantage of the lower fares to travel on the night flights referred to. So popular is this traffic that last summer over 40,000 pasengers passed through Heathrow every week during the hours when shops were compulsorily shut. This is the equivalent of the population of Weymouth and present indications are that this type of traffic is on the increase.

The Bill now before your Lordships' House therefore proposes to exempt shops in passenger buildings, at such international airports as may be designated by the Ministry of Aviation, from the provisions relating to hours of closing and half-days—that is to say, from Part I of the Shops Act, 1950. The Bill is permissive only, and I would stress that it does not affect the rights of employees whether for half-holidays or days off, which are dealt with in Part II of the Shops Act, and which will continue to apply to airports. From the point of view of the convenience of passengers and the public generally, there would be obvious advantages to a blanket exemption of all shops in all airports at all times. I feel, and so do the Promoters of this Bill in another place, that this is too wide and perhaps too controversial an issue to be dealt with as a Private Member's Bill, and it should perhaps await the Committee stage of the next Shops Bill whenever Her Majesty's Government can find time in the legislative programme for such a Bill.

The Bill is intended, primarily, to assist the foreign visitor and other passengers on international flights. Such flights may be of long duration and perhaps, beginning and ending at night, pose more difficult problems than those facing the domestic passenger. Besides, the international passenger is more likely to be subject to "holds", when his aircraft for various reasons has either not arrived or is unable to take off. There are, in any event, more international passengers than domestic ones. In 1961, 80 per cent. of all terminal passengers who passed through Heathrow and Gatwick at times when the shops were shut were international passengers.

The suggestion has been made at various times that there would be unfair competition with local traders. As international airports are perforce some distance from shopping centres, I do not think that there is much truth in the assertion. The employers' side of the Retail Distributive Trades Conference and the Union of Shop, Distributive and Allied Workers have been consulted, and have raised no objection. As I am dealing with consultations, I should perhaps say that the consultative committees of Heathrow and Gatwick, and the local authorities covering Heathrow, Gatwick and Prestwick have expressed positive support for the Bill.

This Bill is a very short one of two clauses. The first and operative clause exempts from the provisions of Part I of the Shops Act, 1950, shops, retail trades and businesses at designated airports. It provides exemption for such parts of designated airports as are ordinarily used by passengers. It also exempts the sale of goods from mobile trolleys and so on in the lounges and concourses of passenger buildings, provided such trolleys are dependent on an exempt shop. Subsection (2) of Clause 1 defines a "designated airport" as one at which there appears to him"— that is, the Minister of Aviation— to be a substantial amount of international passenger traffic. I ought perhaps to ask my noble friend Lord Denham, who is to reply to this short debate, whether the Minister has any idea at the present time which airports he would propose to designate as being international airports and to which this Bill when passed should be applied.

Subsection (3) is a stock provision, which provides the Minister with power to vary or revoke any Order he has made under the Acts. Subsection (4) provides that Orders designating international airports shall be made by statutory instrument. It is not suggested that there is a necessity for these comparatively minor Orders to be subject even to the Negative Resolution procedure in your Lordships' House or in another place. Subsection (5) is technical, and simply accords to expressions in this Bill the same meanings as they have in the Shops Act. Clause 2 gives the Short Title, and provides that the Bill shall not extend to Northern Ireland. This is unnecessary as the Shops Act, 1950, does not apply to Northern Ireland, which is governed by its own Shops Act, 1946. I beg to move.

Moved, That the Bill be now read 2a.—(Viscount Furness.)

7.15 p.m.

LORD SHACKLETON

My Lords, I am sure that we ought to pass this Bill into law, and I should like to congratulate the noble Lord on the rapid and effective way in which he introduced the Second Reading. We ought not to delude ourselves into thinking that this is in every way a satisfactory measure. I congratulate those who were responsible for getting it thus far, and we must see that it passes into law, but it is high time—and I will not pursue the noble Lord, Lord Denham, on this point—that the Government really got down to the question of a revised Shops Act. Already, in general terms, the main purposes are being changed by local option. In Birmingham only recently they have introduced the six-day week by means of an exemption order; and if we are to see the five-day week generally introduced into the retail trade it will probably be necessary for shops to be open six days a week and to introduce the shift system. But, like the noble Viscount, Lord Furness, I do not want to pursue that subject too far.

Of course, the Bill is not going to be too easy to administer. As I understand it, it will apply to international airports. I do not know whether the Government propose to shut off the home side of Heathrow Airport, which also includes flying to Ireland, which is, of course, international flying—at least, it is in the international time tables, whereas flying to Jersey or Edinburgh presumably is not. Presumably, passengers will be able to walk through into the international part. Of course, planes do arrive at awkward hours, and even people from Jersey might like to buy a souvenir, or something of that kind. One gathers that if they fly through to Newcastle or Edinburgh or somewhere like that, even if it is in the middle of the night, while the shops will be open at Heathrow, they will be closed at Edinburgh. But perhaps at Prestwick it will be all right, because it is an international airport. So the Bill is, in this sense, an inevitable "dog's dinner", however much we may approve of it as a small measure.

The other aspect of it, which really is depressing, is the fact that when the Bill was first introduced in another place it provided for Sunday opening. Once again, a very small group of people have been able to hold up a measure which I am quite sure the overwhelming majority of people would have welcomed. Here, again, the position is illogical, because one can buy certain things on a Sunday. One can buy fodder or motor-cycle engines and accessories; one can buy medicines, and medical and surgical appliances, but presumably one cannot buy soap—I do not know. If we look at the Fifth Schedule of the Shops Act, and the powers under another section for partial exemption orders which local authorities can make, we can see how hopelessly inconsistent our position is.

But I quite agree that the sponsors of this Bill were right to accept the best terms they could get; otherwise they would not have got it through another place. I do not think—and I ought to stress that I am speaking personally; not all of my noble friends or other noble Lords would necessarily agree with this—we ought to let this occasion go by without some protest against this sort of dictation and interference, which is a nuisance not only to our own people but to people travelling here from abroad, and it is disadvantageous to the country generally. That, I think, is all one needs to say on that matter.

There is one technical point about which I would ask the noble Lord. In my other capacity I spend a good deal of time administering the Shops Act and wages council orders. I should like to know—and this point probably has arisen in other circumstances—how the statutory half-holiday, which is provided for not merely in the Shops Act but in the relevant wages council orders (and most of the people will, I think, be covered by one wages council order or another) is to be fulfilled for somebody who comes on duty at 9 o'clock or midnight, as he will if the shop is going to be open during the night. Presumably, this will be under the control of the local authority or wages inspectors, but it seems to be a point that is worth noting. With those few words, I declare strong support for the Bill, which I am sure my noble friends on this side of the House would equally wish to see passed into law.

7.21 p.m.

LORD DENHAM

My Lords, Her Majesty's Government welcome this Bill. My noble friend has quoted the recommendations of the Select Committee on Estimates in another place and the conclusions they came to about this matter, and my right honourable friend the Minister of Aviation agrees with those conclusions. International airports, especially Heathrow, are the first sight that foreign visitors have of this country, and it is important that their facilities should be as good as possible. Night opening of airport shops would not only provide a useful amenity to foreign visitors but also be a valuable help to the export trade. This Bill will not compel shops at designated airports to remain open longer than they want to; the decision to remain open would be a matter for their own commercial judgment. The Bill merely removes legal obstacles to shops staying open in order to meet demand when that arises.

The noble Lord, Lord Shackleton, has raised the question of Sunday opening, and before my noble friend replies on that point I think it would be as well if I said a word as to the Government's view on this matter. My right honourable friend is, in principle, in favour of removing airport shops from Sunday closing provisions, but as regards this Bill he is influenced by two considerations. The first is the strength of feeling that is held by certain people against Sunday opening; and the second is the fact that a Committee is at present sitting, under the chairmanship of my noble friend Lord Crathorne, to consider the law relating to Sunday entertainments, sport and trading. In view of these considerations, my right honourable friend is of the opinion that it would be better that the provisions of this Bill should be limited to weekdays.

The noble Lord, Lord Shackleton, also mentioned shop assistants working at night, and asked what was the position about half-holidays. I am advised that the great bulk of the distributive trades are covered by wages councils which, though they cannot prescribe hours of work, lay down wages related to normal hours and ensure that extra hours attract payment at overtime rates. This is a considerable protection for the employee against being required to work excessively long hours, since the cost of excessive overtime is likely to make it uneconomic. My noble friend Lord Furness asked me which airports my right honourable friend would be likely to designate if the Bill becomes law. All I can tell him is that the obvious candidates for his consideration are Heathrow, Gatwick, Prestwick and Manchester. There may well be others, but I do not think it would be proper for me at this stage to speculate on which he would be likely to designate.

In welcoming this Bill, I should like to congratulate my honourable friend the Member for Hartlepools for sponsoring it and piloting it successfully through all its stages in another place, and also my noble friend Lord Furness for the clarity and brevity with which he has introduced it to your Lordships. I hope your Lordships will give the Bill a Second Reading.

LORD SHACKLETON

My Lords, before the noble Lord sits down, may I say that I do not think he answered my point about the statutory half-holiday. He said that overtime will be paid, and this is the normal procedure. I expect that in the shops on the airports, where in fact the statutory overtime rate does not apply in the same way, assistants will be paid above the statutory minimum. But Section 17 of the Shops Act says: Subject to the provisions of this Part of this Act, on at least one week day in each week a shop assistant shall not be employed about the businesss of a shop after half-past one o'clock in the afternoon. This is a provision which is very strictly kept in shops, and I am wondering how it will be applied to somebody who is coming on to work at half-past one in the morning.

LORD DENHAM

My Lords, the point which the noble Lord, Lord Shackleton, has put is quite correct, because of the wording in the Shops Act; but it is already the case, under the 1950 Act, that catering trade workers are not protected in this way, and this Bill merely follows the precedent of the catering trade.

LORD SHACKLETON

I am sorry to pursue this point, but the analogy is not, in fact, valid, because the catering workers operate under their own catering wages order. I do not want to press the noble Lord, but I think a little clarification on this point would be helpful, perhaps at a later stage. Perhaps the noble Lord will make a Third Reading speech to explain that point.

7.27 p.m.

VISCOUNT FURNESS

My Lords, I should very much like to thank my noble friend Lord Denham for his kind remarks on behalf of Her Majesty's Government, and also the noble Lord, Lord Shackleton, for his support of the Bill. I agree with very nearly everything that the noble Lord, Lord Shackleton, has said; but, for the reasons explained by my noble friend Lord Denham, this evening I am rather restricted in my brief to the Bill as it has reached your Lordships' House.

On Question, Bill read 2a, and committed to a Committee of the Whole House.