HL Deb 18 December 1962 vol 245 cc1044-6
THE MARQUESS OF LOTHIAN

My Lords, I should like, with the permission of the House, to repeat a statement made by my right honourable friend the Home Secretary in another place. These are his words:

"With permission, I should like to make a statement about the expenses of witnesses appearing before the Tribunal set up to consider the Vassall case.

"In the course of answering Questions on this subject on November 29 I promised to bring to the notice of the Tribunal all that was said that day in the House. I have done this, and I am glad to be able now to report to the House that the Chairman and members of the Tribunal have been good enough to agree to undertake responsibility for advising in what cases justice requires an ex gratia contribution to the cost of legal representation to be made from public funds and what proportion of the reasonable costs incurred the contribution should, in the view of the Tribunal, in each case represent.

"I will circulate in the OFFICIAL REPORT a copy of a letter from me to Lord Radcliffe and a copy of his reply."

VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLSBOROUGH

My Lords, I take it there will be nothing more in the reply from the Chairman of the Tribunal than has already been indicated: that is, that they will undertake themselves the advice to be given on each individual case. But is that not a little uncertain for the people now wondering whether they ought to obtain legal advice at heavy cost in the meantime? When will a decision of the Tribunal be made in each case?

THE MARQUESS OF LOTHIAN

I think the noble Viscount, the Leader of the Opposition, when he comes to read the letter, if he has not already done so, will find it is made much clearer.

I must confess I had not seen this statement until a few minutes ago and cannot give his the precise answer he requires. But I will make enquiries and let him know, if he is not satisfied when he has seen the letters.

VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLSBOROUGH

I welcome the fact that the Tribunal is itself prepared to give the advice in each case. It is only a question of timing.

LORD AIREDALE

My Lords, is it not right to say that although the published correspondence, I believe, mentions concern in this matter having been expressed only by Members of another place, just as much concern was expressed in your Lordships' House, and just quickly? No doubt the statement is equally gratifying and welcome to the Members of your Lordships' House who expressed their concern at the first opportunity.

Following are the letters referred to in the statement:

Home Office,

Whitehall,

S.W.1.

12th December, 1962. Dear Lord Radcliffe, I made a statement in the House of Commons on the 29th November indicating that, in the case of witnesses appearing before the Tribunal appointed under the Tribunals of Inquiry (Evidence) Act, 1921, to inquire into the Vassall case to whom the Tribunal allows legal representation, the Government would be prepared, in the public interest, to give consideration after the Tribunal has reported to claims which may be made to them for a contribution from public funds to the expenditure incurred. As you will have seen from the report of the discussion which followed (Hansard, Cols. 661 to 665), there was support for the view that, in order to ensure general confidence in the impartiality of the decisions reached on applications for the reimbursement of expenses, the advice of the Tribunal about the disposal of each application should be sought. I should myself welcome this; and I am venturing to inquire whether, in the light of the views expressed in the House of Commons, you and your colleagues would feel able to advise me in what cases of applications for the reimbursement of the costs of legal representation justice requires an ex gratia contribution to be made from public funds, and what proportion of the reasonable costs incurred the contribution should, in the view of the Tribunal, in each case represent. I assume that in most cases the amount of reasonable costs incurred can be settled by agreement; but where this is not possible, I have it in mind to seek the assistance of the Chief Taxing Master. I know that in asking you and your colleagues to assist me in this way I am asking you to add to a burden of public service which is already heavy; but I do very much hope that you may feel able to agree. I shall be most grateful to you if you can.

Yours sincerely,

(Sgd.) HENRY BROOKE,

The Rt. Hon. Viscount Radcliffe, G.B.E.

Tribunal of Inquiry.

14th December, 1962.

DEAR SECRETARY OF STATE, I have discussed with my colleagues the request which you put to us, in your letter of 12th December, that the Tribunal should advise you in what cases of applications for the reimbursement of the costs of legal representation justice required an ex gratia payment from public funds, and what proportion of the reasonable costs incurred the contribution should in each represent. We are prepared to undertake this responsibility. In the light of the views expressed in the House of Commons on this matter, we are prepared to undertake responsibility for giving such advice.

Yours sincerely,

(Sgd.) RADCLIFFE.

The Rt. Hon. Henry Brooke, M.P.