WESTERN EUROPEAN UNION (Hansard, 16 April 1962)

§ VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLSBOROUGH
My Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.

§ THE LORD PRESIDENT OF THE COUNCIL AND MINISTER FOR SCIENCE (VISCOUNT HAILSHAM)
Yes, my Lords. Perhaps I may take the opportunity of saying that I am having copies of the statement concerned placed in the Printed Paper Office of the House. I understand that they will be ready shortly after 3.30 o'clock.

§ VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLSBOROUGH
My Lords, I am not quite sure that I understand that.

§ VISCOUNT HAILSHAM
My Lords, the answer was, Yes. I thought that was one of the few answers which could be understood.

§ VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLSBOROUGH
My Lords, I was thinking of the statement the noble Viscount was talking about. I thought he was referring me to some other statement.

§ VISCOUNT HAILSHAM
No.

§ VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLSBOROUGH
My Lords, I am sorry that the Foreign Secretary is unable to be here to answer this Question, which particularly applies to his Department. The House must be aware that there is a good deal of concern about the way in which these discussions seem to be going, so much outside the knowledge or the confidence of the great majority of the citizens of the country, and especially Members of Parliament. I am glad to know now that a statement is going to be submitted. I managed to get a copy five minutes ago, but it has been quite impossible to read it. However, I understand now that the Press report may be taken as having been indicative of the Government's policy—and I am particularly referring to the report in The Times of Friday last.

§ VISCOUNT HAILSHAM
My Lords, the statement will be available to the House. We followed the usual course in these matters, which was that a perfectly accurate summary was given to the Press. The Times published a large part of the text, and as a large part of the text had been published, we thought it right that the whole text should be available.

§ VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLSBOROUGH
My Lords, I must say that there seem to be a lot of people who think we have been living in a sort of Alice in Wonderland state about this matter for months and months. Most of the country is without any really detailed information. I was promised two months ago that I should get a full official translation of the settlement which had been made between the six nations on agriculture. I have not got it yet. The pressure in the country by what is as much a pressure group as that which organised the setting up of a new channel for the I.T.V. in 1953 has been going on for months and months, and wherever you go people are concerned that they do not know. Then this statement comes out in The Times. Apparently we should not have had an official statement now if at first there had not been this, somewhat of an official leak. That is how I understand the report. But it now can be published this far.
I should like to ask the Government whether they remember that in October last the Lord Privy Seal made a speech and said then that he did not propose to ask for any amendments to the Treaty of Rome. Now, apparently, we are simply heading straght ahead for a political unity, about which we know nothing in detail, except that the Government seem to be going practically full steam ahead both for entering into an economic unity and for a wide European political union. It is about time, as my right honourable Leader said in the country (I did not know he was going to say it when I put this Question down) that we had more information.

§ VISCOUNT HAILSHAM
My Lords, I do not know what the noble Viscount is complaining about. He asked me about a speech made on April 10 by my right honourable friend, and I have put the whole text at his disposal and at the disposal of the House. There is nothing in it about agriculture. As regards the 650 rest of the business, there is certainly no commitment to a European unity in the political sense. I simply do not know what these things are that the noble Viscount is complaining about.

§ VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLSBOROUGH
My Lords, I should say, reading The Times report, that there is as large a commitment as could possibly be made without actually saying it in words. I note with great interest the last paragraph of the report. The speech was described by many W.E.U. representatives yesterday as marking an important stage, because it left them in no doubt that the United Kingdom would play a full part in a future European political community. Mr. Heath's reference to parliamentary control"— that is, European parliamentary control— was regarded as particularly important. At the same time they praised the good tactics and skill with which Mr. Heath had avoided finally committing the United Kingdom in any way. So the whole impression is left that we are going to accept it, and then the skill of the Minister is praised for having avoided a final commitment. These are extraordinary goings-on.

§ VISCOUNT HAILSHAM
My Lords, I should have thought that anyone would endorse the tribute to my right honourable friend's tactics and his skill, which I certainly do. If the noble Viscount thinks that a community is the same thing as a unity, all I can say is that our understanding of the English tongue is not the same.

§ VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLSBOROUGH
My Lords, I will probably come back to this when I have had a chance to study the detailed report of the speech. Certainly I am not impressed by the answers so far.

§ LORD WALSTON
My Lords, while not, I think, arising directly out of what my noble Leader has said, I think it came into his second supplementary Question, and I should like to ask the noble Viscount whether he can give any indication as to when the official translation of the Agriculture Agreement for the Six is likely to be available.

§ VISCOUNT HAILSHAM
My Lords, I believe it is very nearly ready. But if the noble Lord would put down a Question, I might be able to give him a more precise answer than that.