§ 3.35 p.m.
§ LORD SILKINMy Lords, I beg to ask Her Majesty's Government the Question of which I have given Private Notice:
Whether they have any further statement to make about the situation in Katanga and whether they have received any information about the safety of United Kingdom citizens.
THE SECRETARY OF STATE FOR FOREIGN AFFAIRS (THE EARL OF HOME)My Lords, since my statement yesterday, Her Majesty's Consul at Elisabethville has reported that sporadic fighting is still taking place there. United Nations forces have not yet obtained full control of the road between their Headquarters and the airfield. In view of bombing attacks by Katangan aircraft on Elisabethville airfield the United Nations have taken action to neutralise Katangan aircraft on Kolwezi and Jadotville airfields.
Her Majesty's Consul has reported that no British subjects had up to 7.0 a.m. local time to-day been injured, although there had been some very near misses. Some Europeans seeking to leave Katanga and enter Northern Rhodesia had been turned back at road blocks. It is not clear whether any British subjects were involved.
Mr. Tshombe has left Paris for the Katanga. Before he did so a message was conveyed to him through Her Majesty's Embassy at Paris from Sir Roy Welensky. This message, which had the full support of Her Majesty's Government, urged Mr. Tshombe to return to the Katanga to take control of his Government, since the continuation of the fighting could only do irreparable harm to the chance of reconciliation between him and the Central Government.
Senior members of the United Nations Secretariat have assured the United Kingdom representative in New York that the present operations are strictly confined to securing freedom of movement and security of their personnel in and around Elisabethville. They have nothing to do with the carrying out of the Security Council's resolutions of February or November.
§ LORD SILKINMy Lords, I am very much obliged for that statement. Could the noble Earl tell us whether this is really in the form of a police action or whether it is anything more? For instance, what sort of numbers of United Nations forces are involved in this struggle, and does the noble Earl see a speedy end to it or is it likely to go on for some time?
THE EARL OF HOMEMy Lords, my great anxiety, which I pointed out to 172 the United Nations in September and have never ceased to point out since, is that this operation might develop into a campaign in which the United Nations would be involved for years, and that therefore the proper function to which the United Nations forces should be limited was that of keeping rival tribes and factions apart, and preserving law and order. But this is a matter, as I understand it, where United Nations forces are in danger from the Katangan gendarmerie and therefore they must defend themselves and keep the lines of their communications open. The scale of the operations is quite small; there would not be more than 100 or 200 involved.
§ LORD OGMOREMy Lords, may I ask the Foreign Secretary whether the report that appeared in the Press this morning, that the United Nations civil authorities have given way to the military authorities and the military authorities are now in control, is correct?
THE EARL OF HOMEMy Lords, I have made inquiries in New York on that point; but I consider it is absolutely essential that the authorities in New York should keep control. although, of course, for the purposes of some local action they must devolve authority of a military nature.
§ LORD HENDERSONMy Lords, may I ask the noble Earl whether the circumstances are not such as to call for special action by the United Nations to bring the different political leaders together with a view to getting a political settlement? I think most noble Lords will agree with the noble Earl that this continued military operation is merely making the situation worse. It seems to me that there is a parallel to what has taken place in Laos. The United Nations should take action and get them all together in some agreed spot instead of allowing them to talk about meeting in one place or to say they will not meet in another place. The thing is to get them together under the ægis of the United Nations and try to get a political settlement.
THE EARL OF HOMEMy Lords, I find myself in absolutely full agreement with the noble Lord, Lord Henderson, 173 and his objective. The difficulty is that both these gentlemen have refused to meet, and refused everybody. We have all tried, and tried again. There is no reason why the United Nations should not go on trying. I think it is essential they should meet. One is afraid for his life and the other is standing on his dignity. But these two difficulties ought to be able to be overcome.
§ BARONESS SUMMERSKILLMy Lords, may I ask the noble Earl whether he does not think that one reason why Mr. Tshombe is not prepared to meet Mr. Adoula is because of the activities of what has become known as the "Katangan lobby", which consists of influential men who have financial interests in Africa?
§ THE EARL OF SWINTONNonsense.
§ BARONESS SUMMERSKILLWho spoke?
§ THE EARL OF SWINTONI spoke.
§ BARONESS SUMMERSKILLMy Lords, has the time not arrived (because there is great misunderstanding in many countries over this matter) when the noble Earl should denounce the Katangan lobby and uphold the United Nations without any reservation whatsoever? Apart altogether from the financial interests of these evil men who are using power in this way in Africa, the very existence of the United Nations is at stake. That is why all of us want the noble Earl now, at this moment, to declare his allegiance to the United Nations without equivocation.
THE EARL OF HOMEMy Lords, I am against all lobbies who lobby on behalf of one party in the Congo or another, whether the lobby includes some of my friends or whether the lobby includes the noble Lady—I make no distinction. What we want to see is a united Congo, and, as I have time and again said, a federal or confederal solution seems to be the best for that country. Still, the question is a practical one as to how to get two men who differ so strongly to come together in order to work out a constitutional settlement in a country in which there is chaos.
174 When the noble Lady says that the future of the United Nations is at stake, I would agree with her. If the United Nations gets deeply involved in a war extending over the years, or is tempted itself to become a colonial power, that is the end of the United Nations. Therefore I am with her in that. But I want to ensure that the United Nations performs a policing operation and an operation of pacification, and does not get involved in an extended war.
§ LORD STONHAMMy Lords, would the noble Earl agree that the great difficulty in a matter of this kind is in deciding the amount of force needed for pacification and the additional force which could be described as aggression? In such circumstances, would he not agree in regard to men of the United Nations who are disinterestedly and dangerously doing their duty and who, being on the spot, ought to know best in difficult questions of this kind, that it would be better always to give them the benefit of the doubt and to give them our full support?
THE EARL OF HOMEMy Lords, no one could possibly say that we have not given the United Nations the fullest possible support. We have paid out millions of money and are still paying—there is a bill to be paid of £60 million before January 1 of next year. We are willing to pay our share, and we are willing to go on paying. When the noble Lord says that you must always take the advice of the person on the spot, I cannot necessarily agree. We know a great deal about Africa—we have been there for many hundreds of years—and when you are dealing with Africans you want patience, and more patience, and patience again. I do not want to see a situation in which the Secretariat of the United Nations, for want of patience, indulges in warlike activities and takes force beyond the point of policing. I agree with the noble Lord that it is difficult for the Secretariat and difficult for the people in command on the spot. They have our sympathy and they have our support. But I shall have to make it clear when and if we feel that the force is being carried to a point where it will lead the United Nations into an endless war and the Congo into chaos.
§ LORD RATHCAVANMy Lords, may I ask my noble friend whether this 175 is purely a policing action? Is there any truth in the report in the Press this morning that United Nations bombers were used to bomb the airport and also communications? Presumably they were American bombers.
THE EARL OF HOMEMy Lords, the United Nations obtains the weapons that it needs for police action from any and every country which is a member. From the information I have, I think the United Nations troops in Elisabethville were being attacked by aeroplanes which had taken off from certain airfields. The Secretariat in the United Nations, it seems, felt it necessary to give authority that the aeroplanes which were being used for the purpose of attacking the United Nations troops should be put out of action, and they took action to that effect. I think that comes within what I said previously—namely, the protection of lives of United Nations soldiers which may have been in danger.