§ 4.7 p.m.
§ LORD CHESHAMMy Lords, with the leave of the House I should like to make a statement generally similar to that which is being made by my right honourable friend the Postmaster-General in another place. It relates to sound and television broadcasting.
The Government have decided to set up a Committee of Inquiry into the future of sound and television broadcasting. The terms of reference are:
"To consider the future of broadcasting services in the United Kingdom, the dissemination by wire of broadcasting and other programmes, 227 and the possibility of television for public showing; to advise on the services which should in future be provided in the United Kingdom by the B.B.C. and the I.T.A.; to recommend whether additional services should be provided by any other organisation; and to propose what financial and other conditions should apply to the conduct of all these services."
As the Committee will need to consider the technical background, my right honourable friend proposes to ask it to consider the Report which the Television Advisory Committee recently made:
After consultation with my right honourable friend the Prime Minister, my right honourable friend has invited Sir Harry Pilkington to be Chairman of the Committee, and I am glad to inform the House that he has consented. The names of the other members of the Committee will be announced as soon as possible.
The Government have also decided that the B.B.C.'s Charter and Licence should be extended from 30th June, 1962, to 29th July, 1964, the expiry date of the Television Act. Extension of the Charter is subject to the approval of Her Majesty the Queen.
§ VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLSBOROUGHMy Lords, I am obliged to the noble Lord for giving us this information. I wondered, as I listened to him, on what sort of basis the Committee is going to be appointed this time. I have in front of me the names of the Committee set up in 1949, of which the noble Lord, Lord Beveridge, was the Chairman. These names cover a wide range of interest—social, political and commercial. There is no indication at all in the statement made to-day as to whether the same kind of basis is to be followed. I should like to know whether steps can be taken by interested associations and bodies to make sure that their point of view is at least not doomed in the beginning by not having the right sort of people upon the Committee. The second thing I observe—and I am sorry to see it—is the reference to "future services". I hope that we are not going to see in the future an extension of the B.B.C. sound radio of the same kind of stuff which has been adopted already under the I.T.A. It seems to me that these 228 terms of reference are drawn in such a way as to make that a possibility. I am sorry to know that, and I very much hope that it will not materialise.
LORD REAMy Lords, I am sure the House will welcome this Committee and wish it good luck in its work. But, like the noble Viscount, Lord Alexander of Hillsborough, I should like to know how it is related to the current General Advisory Committee of the B.B.C., which continues its good work and is now in operation. Is this work to be superseded, although the Committee has a different function? Secondly, I am a little sorry to note that the scope of this new Committee is confined to the United Kingdom. I may have a bee in my bonnet about these things, but I think that overseas information and what is received from this country by foreigners are far more important than amusement and information in our own homes and flats. Thirdly, I welcome the fact that the Charter date of the B.B.C. is to be extended, and that there will be co-ordination of the two main organisations in that field.
§ EARL WINTERTONMy Lords, may I ask a question and in doing so disclose, as is proper, that I have a directorial interest in television? Front what my noble friend the Minister said, I did not quite understand how this affects the fact that, to use an American term, the franchise of the I.T.A. comes to an end in 1962. Does his statement mean that it is going to be postponed until 1964?
§ LORD CHESHAMMy Lords, if I may first take the question of the noble Viscount about the composition of this Committee, I am not in a position to give any names. But the intention is that people will not be selected or invited by reason of the interest they represent. The aim will be to appoint men and women who, by their personal qualities, will be able to bring the wisest possible approach to the whole of the problem.
§ VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLSBOROUGHMy Lords, I hope that does not mean we are going to exclude Labour and trade union representation.
§ LORD CHESHAMMy Lords, I think I made myself perfectly clear on that point. I cannot see that there is a case for representing interests as such. I think it is a question of finding the best 229 people to do the job, wherever they come from, on a matter of this kind, which is entirely one of recommendations on policy and so on.
§ LORD CHESHAMI was coming to that point in a moment, but I will speak about it now. The noble Lord asked whether this could not be carried out by the existing B.B.C. Advisory Committee. The answer is: No, my Lords, because this Committee will review the whole field of sound and television broadcasting, whether it be B.B.C. or I.T.A. It will no doubt consider also the question of re-diffusion, which I mentioned, and the possibility of public showing of television, and advising on other services. It will have many technical things to think about because of the recommendation of the Television Advisory Committee with regard to lineage of future television development and things like that. So in point of fact it could not be done by the present Committee.
§ LORD SHACKLETONMy Lords, I should like to ask the noble Lord—
§ EARL WINTERTONWill the noble Lord answer my question? It really is an important one.
§ LORD CHESHAMI most certainly will. I thought the noble Lord was intervening on something that I was saying.
§ EARL WINTERTONI thought it was on something different.
§ LORD CHESHAMIt turned out to be, yes. As I understand the matter, the Television Act goes on until 1964, and the idea was to correlate, so to speak, the present term of the B.B.C. Licence and Charter to coincide with the I.T.A.
§ LORD SHACKLETONMy Lords, the setting up of this Committee is, of course, entirely to be expected, and I thoroughly agree with the noble Lord that the B.B.C. Advisory Committee is not the body to deal with this particular inquiry. I should like to ask the noble Lord about the really curious wording and curious detail—wards like "the possibility", and, in particular, whether the sentence
…to recommend whether additional services should be provided by any other organisation…230 implies that additional services are not likely to be provided by existing organisations such as the B.B.C. or the I.T.A. I should also like to know whether, in view of the fact that the Government went entirely against the recommendations of the last Committee of Inquiry, the Beveridge Committee, which came down strongly against the introduction of commercial radio, there is any chance of their accepting the recommendations of this new Committee.
§ LORD CHESHAMMy Lords, however much the noble Lord may disapprove of the Government from across the Floor of the House, I should hardly have thought that the Government would take the trouble of setting un a Committee to whose recommendations they knew, before the Committee was even composed, they had no intention of attending.
§ LORD STONHAMThat is precisely what they did in the case of the Committee of which the noble Lord, Lord Beveridge, was Chairman. They actually turned down the recommendations.
§ LORD CHESHAMYes, my Lords, but I still stick to my point. What the noble Lord said was exactly what the noble Lord, Lord Shackleton, had said, and I was replying to that when he intervened to say it. But I still stick to my point. I cannot bind the Government or any other Government to accept in advance the recommendations that a Committee may make, and I do not think noble Lords opposite would expect that either. All I say is that we think it proper to set up this Committee to look into this question, in order to get an informed and imaginative approach to these various technical, complicated and diverse problems.
The noble Lord, Lord Shackleton, asked me about what I meant by "possibility". It is easily explained. We have at the moment no public showing of television in this country. The matter was left open in the previous White Paper. It is thought right for this Committee to reconsider the question of whether there should be showing of television in public places. That is what is meant by the word "possibility". So 231 far as additional services are concerned, there is no threat in that. It does not mean at all that, if there were to be additional services recommended, the B.B.C. or the I.T.A. would be debarred from running them. Neither does it mean that if additional services were required which could not be provided by the existing bodies, something else could not be thought of to run them. In other words, it is intended to leave the question quite open, and there is no hidden threat.