HL Deb 15 December 1960 vol 227 cc596-8
EARL WINTERTON

My Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.

[The Question was as follows:

To ask Her Majesty's Government if the smallpox epidemic in Nyasaland has now abated, what is the estimated number of the inhabitants of Nyasaland who have been vaccinated during the present year and whether any action is possible under the laws of Nyasaland to prosecute those persons who, by intimidation, have attempted to persuade the inhabitants of Nyasaland not to be vaccinated.]

THE MINISTER OF STATE FOR COLONIAL AFFAIRS (THE EARL OF PERTH)

My Lords, health is a responsibility of the Federal Government, but am informed that the epidemic has not yet subsided. The total number vaccinated is over 480,000. When intimidation involves threats of unlawful action, such as violence to persons or property, or is carried out by unlawful means. including unlawful conspiracy, the laws of Nyasaland provide for action to be taken against the offenders. In two instances where medical teams have been hindered by physical intimidation the authorities brought forward cases for trial. One has resulted in the conviction of the principal offenders, and the other is shortly to be heard.

EARL WINTERTON

My Lords, I am obliged to the noble Earl for his Answer. May I ask him whether he is aware, as no doubt he is, that a serious charge has been made—which, I think, takes the form of a Motion in another place (but that I must not refer to) and also reports in the Press—against Dr. Banda and the Party which he leads, that he, being a doctor and having himself been vaccinated, did his best to persuade his followers to intimidate those who wished to be vaccinated? Whatever may be the constitutional position vis-à-vis the Nyasaland Government—

SEVERAL NOBLE LORDS

Order, order!

EARL WINTERTON

—would it not be fairer to Dr. Banda to say whether or not this statement is true?

THE EARL OF PERTH

My Lords, I feel quite sure that Dr. Banda is well able to take care of himself—we have seen that on various other occasions. I would just say that I am not aware of any statement that he has made along the lines that the noble Earl has indicated.

EARL WINTERTON

In that case, may we have an assurance from the Minister that all steps will be taken in the future to prevent such intimidation as has taken place in the past? I must not refer to other instances of intimidation, but some very serious charges have been brought against Dr. Banda in connection with this and other matters in the last few days by Africans themselves.

THE EARL OF PERTH

My Lords, on the question of intimidation, as your Lordships know, it is very often a difficult thing to prove. But where there is a ease which can be brought to court the Nyasaland Government will certainly take the necessary steps; and, as I say, they have done so in these instances I have already indicated.

VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLSBOROUGH

My Lords, is the Minister aware that, as I indicated the other day when the statement on the Conference was made, we are all anxious to be fairly restrained as to what we raise about this matter just now, until we can see where we are going as regards the Conference? It is fundamental to have the best relationships possible. The other thing I should like to ask is this: is the Minister satisfied that in this vaccination campaign the local authorities have been able to achieve the reasonable target they set themselves in the number of cases dealt with?

THE EARL OF PERTH

My Lords, to the extent that there has been intimidation, clearly the target they set themselves has not been fulfilled

EARL WINTERTON

Does the Minister mean that intimidation was carried out on a wide scale; and, if so, why can we not have a more definite answer on the matter?

THE EARL OF PERTH

It does not mean that. I have said expressly that there were two cases of physical intimidation of the medical teams which tried to do the vaccination, and in both those cases the Nyasaland Government have prosecuted or are prosecuting.

EARL WINTERTON

But no doubt the Minister is aware that an African of great position stated on the wireless last Mat that he had been intimidated and, indeed, assaulted.

THE EARL OF PERTH

That, I believe, has nothing to do with the question of vaccination.