§ 2.35 p.m.
§ VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLSBOROUGHhad given Notice of two Questions—namely:
§ To ask Her Majesty's Government when the detention of Dr. Hastings Banda will be reviewed.
§ To ask Her Majesty's Government when the sentences of detention on Mr. H. B. Chipembere, Mr. D. K. Chisiza and other detainees not yet brought to trial will be reviewed.
§ The noble Viscount said: My Lords, I beg leave to ask the first Question standing in my name on the Order Paper.
§ THE MINISTER OF STATE FOR COLONIAL AFFAIRS (THE EARL OF PERTH)My Lords, with your Lordships' permission I will answer the two Questions asked by the noble Viscount, Lord Alexander of Hillsborough, together. The answer is materially the same for both. Under Regulation 24 (8) of the Emergency Regulations, 1959, the Governor of Nyasaland is required to review detention orders every six months. He reviewed the cases of Dr. Banda, Mr. Chisiza and Mr. Chipembere last month. He will, therefore, be required formally to review their cases again in March, 1960. The process of review is, however, continuous, and no one is detained any longer than is necessary, in the opinion of the Governor, for the preservation of law and order in the territory.
§ VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLSBOROUGHMy Lords, may I ask the noble Earl when, if at all, any charge is to be brought against Dr. Banda, 36 especially if the Government have fully considered the Report of the Devlin Commission? How long is this Christian man to be kept in detention without trial, without charge, and, according to the Devlin Commission, with no specific evidence against him?
§ THE EARL OF PERTHMy Lords, I think the question of whether he should be brought to trial is a matter for the Attorney-General of the country to decide. The question of detention is essentially one for the Governor in his own discretion, bearing in mind in particular the need to preserve law and order in his territory.
§ VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLSBOROUGHWhat has just been said is merely another implication without proof. Is it not a fact that the state of emergency in Nyasaland could not have been declared without the consent of the Government's Secretary of State for the Colonies? Is it not due to the approval of Her Majesty's Government? How long is this going to last, and when are you going to bring these British citizens, now under detention without charge, to an actual trial? What are you going to do?
§ THE EARL OF PERTHMy Lords, the question of the length of time for an emergency is something which again is for the Governor to decide, in conjunction, of course, with the Secretary of State for Colonial Affairs and the Government here.
§ VISCOUNT STANSGATEMy Lords, will the noble Earl give us any evidence to show that in the opinion of the Government it was necessary to continue the emergency?
§ THE EARL OF PERTHI think, if you remember the Devlin Report, you will recall that it was agreed that the Governor had to act or abdicate.
§ LORD SHEPHERDMy Lords, is it right that the court has found that a person in a British Protectorate has a right to appeal to a British court in this country for habeas corpus? May I ask the noble Earl whether Doctor Banda has lost that right by being moved out of a British Protectorate into Southern Rhodesia?
§ THE EARL OF PERTHMy Lords, I am afraid I must have written notice of that question.
LORD REAMay I ask the noble Earl whether, even if it is necessary for the trial to be postponed, there is any valid reason why the charges it is proposed to prefer should not be made known to these people?
§ THE EARL OF PERTHMy Lords, I do not think that that question arises at the moment. The position is that the Governor has decided that it is necessary to keep these people in detention under emergency powers for the time being.
§ VISCOUNT STANSGATEThen this is all based on an obiter dictum of Mr. Justice Devlin, given some months ago, that the Governor must act or abdicate. Is that so?
§ THE EARL OF PERTHI did not say that. I said that Mr. Justice Devlin and his Committee in their Report accepted the fact that the Governor had no choice but to act or abdicate.
§ VISCOUNT STANSGATEMy Lords, is that the continuing opinion of the Government to-day? That is the point.
§ THE EARL OF PERTHMy Lords, I do not think that that arises from the original Question.
§ VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLSBOROUGHMy Lords, may I ask the noble Earl whether he has yet read the Prime Minister's speech yesterday in another place, and, if so, whether he expects that the Prime Minister's request for co-operation with, I will call it, the Monckton Commission, which is in process of being set up, will actually be forthcoming unless we can know now what you are going to do with Dr. Banda, and whether that Commission will be enabled, or will be charged, to consult with these African leaders and consider their inquiries before recommendations are made to the Government and to the Conference which meets next year?
§ THE EARL OF PERTHMy Lords, I think that perhaps we are getting into the position of debate on a subject which no doubt will come up in the general debate which we are to have on the gracious Speech. If that is so, I think it is more appropriate to deal with 38 those issues at that time. I would only say that of course I have read the Prime Minister's speech.
§ VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLSBOROUGHMy Lords, we should all like to clear our minds a little on the factual position to-day of Government policy. We shall return to the matter and move an Amendment to the loyal Address next Tuesday.
§ EARL WINTERTONMy Lords, may I ask the Minister whether the factual position is not this: that the electorate, by an enormous majority, approved of Her Majesty's Government's policy in Nyasaland?
§ THE EARL OF PERTHMy Lords, those are the facts.
§ VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLSBOROUGHMy Lords, is the noble Earl aware that the total vote of the Conservative Party was a minority of the electorate?