HL Deb 13 May 1959 vol 216 cc360-2

Clause 33, page 14, line 6, leave out subsection (3) and insert— ("(3) Notwithstanding the provisions of section twenty-one of this Act, or of any order made thereunder, it shall not be an offence for an occupier of agricultural land or of enclosed woodlands, or for any person authorised by him in writing in that behalf, to take or kill during a close season any deer found on any arable land, garden grounds or land laid down in permanent grass (other than moorland and unenclosed land) forming part of that land, or on such woodlands, as the case may be. (4) Notwithstanding the provisions of subsection (1) of section twenty-three of this Act, it shall not be an offence for an occupier of agricultural land or of enclosed woodlands to take or kill during the period specified in that subsection any deer found on any such arable land, garden grounds or land laid down in permanent grass as aforesaid, or on such woodlands, as the case may be. (5) The provisions of the last two foregoing subsections shall be construed as one with the Agriculture (Scotland) Act, 1948.") Third Schedule, page 19, line 39, column 3, at end insert ("in section forty-three, subsection (2)").

LORD FORBES

My Lords, with your Lordships' permission I will take Amendments 41 and 45 together. The effect of these Amendments is, first of all, to exempt from the close season penal provisions the occupier of agricultural land or enclosed woodland, or any person authorised by him, killing deer on his enclosed or arable land or woodland; and secondly, to exempt from the night-shooting penal provisions the occupier of agricultural land or enclosed woodlands killing deer on his enclosed, arable or wooded land. There is therefore no question, in the second case, of the occupier authorising other people to do the work for him. If there were, it might lead to collusion between poachers and unscrupulous occupiers. The third point is that Section 43 (2) of the Agriculture (Scotland) Act, 1948, is repealed. This restricted the tenant's statutory right to kill deer to the hours of daylight. I beg to move that this House doth agree with the Commons in the said Amendments.

Moved, That this House doth agree with the Commons in the said Amendments.—(Lord Forbes.)

VISCOUNT MASSEREENE AND FERRARD

My Lords, I think the fact that people are going to be able to shoot deer with rifles by night is extremely dangerous, apart from being extremely cruel. There are bound to be a great number of wounded deer. I cannot understand how this Amendment came to be proposed. I think it is extremely unsatisfactory.

THE DUKE OF ATHOLL

My Lords, I cannot understand why, when people have not been allowed to shoot deer on enclosed land by night since 1948, it is now necessary in 1959, in a Bill designed to introduce a close season and to stop cruelty to deer, to bring in this rather remarkable provision. While the rest of the Commons Amendments are fairly satisfactory I feel that this one seems to be going back on the whole object of the Bill.

LORD FORBES

My Lords, this merely enables the owner-occupier or the tenant-occupier to protect his own crops —that is, crops that are on enclosed land.

VISCOUNT ASTOR

Is there no reference to the Commission in this matter? Can the occupier do this as much as he wants? Is there no possible appeal against abuse in this connection? Surely it is a very wide and extensive power to give, without requiring that permission be obtained, and without there being any form of supervision over these owners.

LORD FORBES

My Lords, the Commission do not come into the matter of a farmer's, an occupier's, right to protect his own crops.

VISCOUNT MASSEREENE AND FERRARD

My Lords, I have known of instances where tenants have made holes in the fences so that the deer can come on to their crops in order that they can shoot them by night. It is extremely unsatisfactory.

On Question, Motion agreed to.