HL Deb 07 May 1959 vol 216 cc209-12

3.11 p.m.

THE SECRETARY OF STATE FOR COMMONWEALTH RELATIONS (THE EARL OF HOME)

My Lords, I beg to move the Motion standing in my name on the Order Paper.

Moved, That Standing Order No. 35 be suspended until the House adjourns for the Recess at Whitsun for the purpose of giving Government Business (except with the consent of the Government) precedence over other Notices and Orders of the Day, and that Standing Order No. 41 (no two stages of a Bill to be taken on one day) be suspended for the aforesaid period.—(The Earl of Home.)

VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLS-BOROUGH

My Lords, this is the kind of Motion that we almost always agree to without any comment. But I am rather anxious about next Wednesday, the 12th. My noble friend Lord Nathan has had on the Paper now for months a Motion with regard to charities, and I hope that the usual channels may be able to arrange that there should be no interference with the Motion of a noble Lord who has waited for so long to bring a matter to the notice of your Lordships.

LORD REA

My Lords, in respect of the subject which the noble Viscount, Lord Alexander of Hillsborough, has mentioned, there are other noble Lords who are very anxious to follow the noble Lord, Lord Nathan, in that particular Motion. It is not a matter of one noble Lord, but, as I am quite sure the noble Earl is aware, of several.

THE EARL OF HOME

I have looked at the Business, and it struck me that Wednesday might be congested. However, I think that if we discuss this matter through the usual channels we shall be able to find a way out. I am very anxious that the Motion should not be delayed too long.

VISCOUNT STANSGATE

My Lords, I do not know whether anyone is going to ask this question, but shall we have repeated here the statement which the Government are to make in another place concerning the Kenya detention camps?

THE EARL OF HOME

The answer is that there is to be no statement in another place to-day. Perhaps my noble friend Lord Perth may have a word to add on that.

THE MINISTER OF STATE FOR COLONIAL AFFAIRS (THE EARL OF PERTH)

My Lords, there is going to be no statement to-day. I know that ordinarily we do not take notice of what happens in another place, but perhaps it may be helpful to your Lordships to know that there is a Question down in another place in regard to these happenings. Whether or not it will be reached orally I have no way of telling. But if the noble Viscount, Lord Stansgate, as the result of what happens today, likes to put any Question down, let us say, for Tuesday, I shall be very happy to deal with it.

VISCOUNT STANSGATE

My Lords, it was an established practice, when the noble Marquess, Lord Salisbury was leading the House—a cherished practice—that statements in another place should be read in this House. As regards putting down a Question, we are not going to meet again until Tuesday, and there are one or two urgent matters—not controversial—which arise. For example, are we going to have a report from Mr. Goudie, the coroner? Are we to have a print of the statement, what is called the Cowan plan? Those are two most important matters which I should like to know about before the House rises to-day.

THE EARL OF HOME

My Lords, of course there has been no change in the practice of this House since my noble friend Lord Salisbury was Leader. Now that I am leading the House, if there is a statement in another place we make it here. The Leader of the Opposition knows that. There is to be no statement, but there is a Question down in another place, though it may not be reached. The noble Viscount is very vigilant in these matters, but if he had been a little more vigilant he might have thought out these questions which he is now asking, and put down a Private Notice Question. As he has not done so, I am afraid that I must ask him to wait until Tuesday.

VISCOUNT STANSGATE

My Lords, I do not at all resent the reproof, but I should like to know how on earth one could ask a question when, for the first time, the report appeared only this morning in The Times—a full account, upon which I base two simple questions which are not controversial but which touch the very centre of the whole matter.

THE EARL OF HOME

My Lords, the noble Viscount did not give myself or anybody else notice that he wanted to ask a Private Notice Question and he has only for the first time, this minute, asked the question, which puts any Minister in an impossible position. He will see the Answer which the Minister gives in another place, if the Question is reached; and my noble friend Lord Perth, has offered to meet the noble Viscount.

VISCOUNT STANSGATE

My Lords, the noble Earl is mistaken. At ten o'clock this morning I rang his office on the position, and I said that I assumed that the statement which The Times said was to be made in the Commons would be made here, and that, if so, I had supplementary questions to ask. That notice was given to his office at four minutes past ten this morning.

THE EARL OF HOME

But the assumption of the noble Viscount was wrong—there was no statement to be made.

VISCOUNT STANSGATE

Equally, the statement of the noble Earl was wrong when he said that he had had no notice.

THE EARL OF HOME

Perhaps we are quits.

On Question, Motion agreed to, and ordered accordingly.