FEDERAL CONSTITUTION OF RHODESIA AND NYASALAND

HL Deb 21 July 1959 vol 218 cc309-15

3.35 p.m.

THE SECRETARY OF STATE FOR COMMONWEALTH RELATIONS (THE EARL OF HOME)

My Lords, perhaps the House will allow me a short intervention to deal with a statement which the Prime Minister is making in another place about the machinery to prepare the ground for the Review of the Federal Constitution of Rhodesia and Nyasaland which is to take place towards the end of 1960. I will read the rest in the Prime Minister's own words, for the convenience of your Lordships.

"As is generally known, I have had a number of private talks with the Leader of the Opposition and some of his colleagues on this matter. My right honourable friends and I have had the advantage of personal discussions with Sir Roy Welensky, the Federal Prime Minister, and we have also been in consultation with the Prime Minister of Southern Rhodesia and the Governors of Northern Rhodesia and Nyasaland. It is now the duty of Her Majesty's Government to put forward definite proposals which I have communicated to the Leader of the Opposition. The 1960 Review will be of major importance in determining the future of Central Africa. Great issues, human and political will be at stake—issues of constitutional evolution, economic development and interracial harmony. The Government are convinced that careful preparation of this Conference is essential. Officials of the five Governments are already engaged in assembling the necessary material. Nevertheless, we are convinced that some additional constructive preparation is desirable. Accordingly we propose that an Advisory Commission be appointed for this purpose with the following terms of reference: 'In the light of the information provided by the Committee of Officials and of any additional information the Commission may require, to advise the five Governments in preparation for the 1960 Review, on the constitutional programme and framework best suited to the achievement of the objects contained in the Constitution of 1953, including the preamble.' "The membership of the Commission will be as follows: The Chairman—from the United Kingdom. Six Privy Counsellors—Members of the United Kingdom Parliament (including three from Opposition Parties). Six independent members, of whom four will be chosen from the United Kingdom and two, we hope, from other Commonwealth countries having experience of the working of a federal Constitution. Four to come from the Federation as a whole, to be proposed by the Federal Government. Three from Southern Rhodesia, to be proposed by the Southern Rhodesian Government. Three each from Northern Rhodesia and Nyasaland. "Of the thirteen members drawn from Central Africa, five will be Africans and none will be members of their respective Governments or Legislatures. The names will be announced in due course.

"We think that a comprehensive Commission of this kind will enable Governments to approach the Conference with the best possible advice at their disposal; promote greater public understanding of the issues involved; and do something to create a common approach to these very difficult problems among all concerned. Our paramount object, in considering this matter, has been to try to create both here and in Africa a common mind on the next stages of the political evolution of the Federation. This seems to us the imaginative and creative course.

"We have thought it right that Europeans and Africans who live in Rhodesia and Nyasaland should have a part in the consideration of matters so vital to their future. For this is not an academic exercise. It concerns the lives and homes of all the population of Rhodesia and Nyasaland, of whatever race. At the same time we are anxious to have a broad cross-section of opinion and knowledge from this country, and some entirely independent advice from elsewhere in the Commonwealth.

"The Commission will be expected to hold their first meeting in London in the autumn to plan their programme of work. By that time material will also be becoming available to them from the Committee of Officials of the five Governments which, as I have said, will in any case be carrying out an official factual survey and analysis in advance of the 1960 Conference.

"The proposal which I have outlined has been worked out in consultation with the Government of the Federation and the other authorities concerned, all of whom are determined to make their best possible contribution to the work of the Commission, to designate for it people of distinction and independent mind, and to give it all necessary facilities.

"Where so much is at stake the Government have felt that a comprehensive and creative approach is needed. The work of the Commission will be onerous but will, I hope, be fruitful.

"I am sure that this hope will be shared by everyone in this country of whatever Party or political opinion. I therefore trust that honourable Members in all parts of the House will give this Advisory Commission their support and goodwill."

3.40 p.m.

VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLSBOROUGH

My Lords, we are obliged to the noble Earl the Leader of the House, who is Secretary of State for Commonwealth Relations, for making this statement to your Lordships. It is upon a very important issue. Moreover, it is to be debated to-morrow in another place. I hope your Lordships will realise that while we on this side of the House will be second to none in doing all that we possibly can to secure that essential principles shall operate in Central Africa, and all we do will be for their general development and advancement, we are not necessarily in agreement at all with the type of action which the Government now propose.

I must recall to your Lordships' minds the fact that the Parliamentary Opposition in both Houses made it clear to Her Majesty's Government soon after the unfortunate events in Nyasaland that we very much desired that a Parliamentary delegation should go out to ascertain the facts and to report to the United Kingdom Parliament, who, of course, are still responsible for the people of Nyasaland, and that we should be glad to collaborate in anything which was done to secure that end. Many months have gone by since that happened, and now we have this proposal before us to-day.

May I say that my own personal reaction to it is this. It may appeal very much to those who are at present in governmental authority in the Federation, although I dare say it was difficult enough to persuade them actually to take part in a Commission. But on the basis set before us, no doubt it will be welcomed by the members of the Government of the Federation. But I cannot see that it is likely to be acceptable at all to native African opinion in Central Africa in the circumstances about which many of us have heard and in what many of us know to be the actual situation. So we regret very much that the Government have not adopted the kind of Parliamentary Commission which the official Opposition in both Houses wished the Government to adopt which was, to find out the facts and then to advise our Government and Parliament as to what our attitude should be in what we understood was to be a real round-table conference in 1960.

This is a very different procedure. It appears to me, from the terms of reference, that the Commission now to be set up will be doing the work which was obviously intended to be done by the round-table Commission in 1960. However, I do not want to go into that in detail to-day, as we have a lot of Business before us. We shall no doubt be afforded by the Leader of the House, through the usual channels, some means of arranging a debate on this matter before the House rises.

In the meantime, I should like to ask a question as to what the timing is to be—that is to say, when is the Commission to be appointed? It looks to me now, from the actual statement made, that they are going to be appointed almost at once, in August or September, and it is vaguely suggested that they are going to meet probably in the autumn. But the autumn is a widespread term of application. Might I ask whether there is going to be a General Election this autumn or not?

SEVERAL NOBLE LORDS: Hear, hear!

VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLSBOROUGH

It is of importance to remember that. If there is, is this Commission going to sit? Are Privy Counsellors to be appointed by the Government and Opposition sides as at present constituted in Parliament? Are they going to be available during the autumn Election period? What exactly is proposed to be done? Let us have a little light upon the situation, and let us try to consider exactly where we are and what we are going into.

Then I should like to ask a question about the position of the Commonwealth countries who are to be represented. We have no indication at all in the statement made. It is just put down as people experienced in Federation. Does that confine it to Australia and Canada? Is there to be any question of its being entirely wide representation? Are you going to consider any other Dominion? Will you consider India, for example? I think we ought to know just where we are going in that direction. Another matter upon which I should like a little clarification is this. It is noted that the statement says that the Commission will report to all five Governments concerned. When? They are not going to meet until the autumn. What is the timetable? Is the final round-table Commission in 1960 to be delayed or postponed to give it time to do this very big job, or what? Does the appointment of a United Kingdom Chairman mean that we shall get the Report first, or are they going to report simultaneously to all the Parliaments, including Nyasaland and Northern Rhodesia?

Then there is another question the answer to which I think we ought to know. From what the Leader of the House has said in the statement about the appointment of five Africans, I note that apparently none of the Central African representatives are to be connected with either the Legislature or the Government. I take it that that applies to every one of the thirteen. But who is going to apoint the five Africans? And how are they going to be selected? Incidentally, I might have asked that about the Commonwealth representatives. I suggest that they will certainly be nominated by whichever country is going to be represented. But who is going to appoint these five Africans? I think that if we had information on this point it would be very helpful.

THE EARL OF HOME

My Lords, I am obliged to the noble Viscount. I will not depress him by telling him when there is going to be a General Election, although whenever it is the result will be the same. The noble Viscount asked me about Parliamentary representation, because he said that the Opposition had preferred a Parliamentary delegation. We have, as he will observe, included a proposal for six Privy Counsellors representative of the Government and the Opposition. He then asked me about timing. It is not the Prime Minister's intention to appoint people until the autumn, so I hope the noble Viscount and his Party will not commit themselves to-day, but will look at this proposal, because it has considerable merits. Therefore I would consider that the timing might be something like this: the appointment of persons in the autumn, by which time the Committee of officials will have assembled a lot of information. It might be that the Commission will meet before Christmas here, and then, I would hope, have a long time in the Federation to study matters on the spot and be in a position to report to both Houses of Parliament in good time for the autumn Review of 1960. That is how I visualise the timing.

So far as the Commonwealth members are concerned, the important thing is—and again I do not want to suggest names, or even where they should come from—for the Commission to have the benefit of the experience of persons who have actually worked or are working a federal system. Lastly, the point the noble Viscount made about the Africans. They will be appointed and invited by the Governors in the two territories—the Governor of Nyasaland and the Governor of Northern Rhodesia—and, of course, by the Prime Minister of Southern Rhodesia and the Federal Prime Minister respectively. With regard to the African representation, the House will notice that out of thirteen members from Central Africa, five will be Africans.

VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLSBOROUGH

My Lords, I am much obliged to the noble Earl. May I say that I hope very much that the United Kingdom Government will have a great deal to say about the appointments made by the Governor of Nyasaland and Northern Rhodesia, as to who are the representatives of the African population. I hope that some contact may be made with the bodies who are not in agreement in general with the recent policy of the Central Federation and that that kind of opinion may be represented. I think that that is a reasonable thing to ask. As regards the rest of the answer, may I say that in a matter of such vital importance to them and to us we do not want to make up our minds hurriedly and without consideration. We have certainly got another twenty-four hours, at least, to sit upon these things and study them, but I felt I was bound to say to the noble Earl the Leader of the House, in all honesty, that we had promised collaboration on the basis of the kind of Commission we wanted to be set up. This is a different thing. We shall have to consider that now, and we will consider it very carefully and sympathetically.

THE EARL OF HOME

My Lords, I thank the noble Viscount. Promising collaboration on the basis of your own ideas is always very attractive, but I hope we can come to some common opinion on this matter.