DEER (SCOTLAND) BILL [H.L.] (Hansard, 22 January 1959)

§ THE LORD PRESIDENT OF THE COUNCIL (VISCOUNT HAILSHAM)
My Lords, I have it in Command from Her Majesty the Queen to signify to the House that Her Majesty, having been informed of the purport of the Deer (Scotland) Bill, has consented to place Her Majesty's interest, as far as it is concerned on behalf of the Crown, at the disposal of Parliament for the purposes of the Bill.

§ THE MINISTER OF STATE, SCOTTISH OFFICE (LORD FORBES)
My Lords, I beg to move that this Bill be read a third time. As your Lordships have given such exceptional and diligent attention to the Bill there is no need for me to say much about it now, except to thank all who have taken part in the debates and, in particular, those noble Lords who were instrumental in getting Amendments made to it. The Government accept that the Bill has been improved in a number of respects: for example, as regards the composition of the Red Deer Commission, the option given to the owner or occupier to kill marauding deer in the first place, and the provision for close seasons for species other than red deer. While the Government were clean bowled on Tuesday over the question of the date when close seasons come into force, I cannot but admire the humanitarian spirit of those of your Lordships who felt unable to support the Government.
I am glad to feel that in future the farmer and the forester will have much more protection from red deer which, like ourselves, sometimes prefer caviare to rough pasture; because there can be nothing more frustrating to a farmer or forester who has laboured to grow a fine crop than to find it diminishing each morning he looks at it. It is good to know that so many noble Lords take such a keen interest in deer of all species—some known, some almost unknown—and also in stalking, which is one of the few sports where complete mechanisation has not yet crept in. The sportsman still has time to see and marvel at the wonders of nature all around him, even 724 though he may be puffing and panting behind a stalker whose legs always seem to be twice as long as his own. Now at last the roar of the stags has died down as this Bill is about to be carried over the march into another place. I only hope that this Bill will not again disturb the peace of your Lordships' House.

VISCOUNT ELIBANK
My Lords, as one who took some considerable part in this Bill, I should like to say a few words. As the noble Lord has said, it is certainly a better Bill to-day than it was when he first introduced it. It is a measure for which we have pressed for many years, and I think everybody who has taken any interest in the subject will be pleased indeed that the Bill is going now to another place. I hope that the Government do not intend to take out any of the Amendments which were introduced into the Bill, particularly the Amendment by which the time at which the close season is to come into operation is brought forward. As the Government know, that Amendment was carried against them because noble Lords felt so warmly about it.
There is only one other thing I should like to say. This is the first Bill which the noble Lord, Lord Forbes, has handled in this House, and those of us with some little knowledge of the subject know that it was not an easy Bill. But, if I may say so with great respect, the noble Lord performed his task most admirably. All of us interested in this subject have the greatest admiration for the way in which he has carried through the passage of the Bill.

§ LORD GREENHILL
My Lords, I should like to support what has just been said about the difficulties the noble Lord, Lord Forbes, had to overcome in getting this Bill through. Although his passage was rough, he will probably be a much better Minister for the experience. There are two things I should like to say. The first is that, thanks, if one may say so, to the influence of the Nature Conservancy, who were able to reconcile two conflicting interests in this matter, we have some measure of agreement. On the whole, I think the Bill reflects that kind of 725 balanced view that they were able to get adopted. Secondly, I should like to give a word of warning. The 1948 Agriculture (Scotland) Act was one in which the Secretary of State was given certain wide powers. For reasons which were discussed during the passage of this Bill, it was said that he did not exercise those powers. Those powers are now being transferred to the Commission—a much better body in its composition than was originally suggested. I hope, therefore, that these powers will be operated in the interests of all the Scottish deer.