HL Deb 14 December 1959 vol 220 cc367-72

4.9 p.m.

THE MINISTER WITHOUT PORTFOLIO (THE EARL OF DUNDEE)

My Lords, with your Lordships' permission, I will read the statement about the arrangements for the call-up to the Forces in 1960 which was made a short time ago in another place by my right honourable frend the Minister of Labour. It is as follows:

"It has already been announced that there will be no further call-up after 1960 and that men born on or after 1st October, 1939, will not have to register under the National Service Acts. The needs of the Services for National Servicemen during the remaining period of call-up have therefore to be met by men born in or before September, 1939. Most of those concerned will be men who have had their call-up deferred to complete their training or studies, so as to become skilled workers or obtain professional or academic qualifications. The remainder well be largely men born in the third quarter of 1939, because men in earlier age groups who did not receive deferment have almost all been called up already.

"It is now clear that the number of men whose deferment is due to end in 1960 and who will become available for call-up is likely to be appreciably larger than is required. The Government have therefore decided that men whose deferment for training or study ends on or after 1st June next will not be called up. The great majority of the men affected by this decision will be apprentices, but university students and men taking professional qualifications will also be affected. The decision will also apply to men granted a period of post-apprenticeship deferment under the special scheme for certain work of high priority.

"Men whose deferments expire or are terminated before 1st June, 1960, and those who have not been deferred, will continue to be called up for service in the ordinary way. In addition, men whose call-up has been deferred for so long as they remain in their present employment such as coalminers, members of the Merchant Navy or secondary school teachers, and men who have had their call-up postponed on the ground that it would cause exceptional hardship, may expect to be called up if their deferment or postponement finishes before the end of 1960. The special arrangements for doctors and dentists are unchanged.

"I will circulate in the OFFICIAL REPORT details of the classes affected. Those concerned will be informed individually in the next few weeks."

Following are the details referred to:

Men liable for National Service whose call-up is deferred as below and whose determent is due to expire on or after 1st June, 1960, will not be called up.

  1. (1) Men deferred by a National Service deferment board as learners, apprentices, student apprentices, articled pupils, articled clerks, or for training as technicians, or for approved part-time studies having a vocational bearing;
  2. (2) Men (other than medical and dental students) deferred by a university joint recruiting board for a first or higher degree or an approved diploma or similar course, including a sandwich course;
  3. (3) Any university graduates or graduate apprentices deferred by a National Service deferment board for approved practical training following graduation;
  4. (4) Students at teacher training colleges, farm institutes, or on practical training on the land;
  5. (5) Theological and missionary students and similar classes;
  6. (6) Former apprentices in certain engineering occupations granted deferment, following termination of apprenticeship, for employment on designated work of importance for defence or exports ("post-apprenticeship deferment").

VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLSBOROUGH

My Lords, I am much obliged to the noble Earl for that statement. May I take it that in coming to this decision, which really presents a sort of Chinese puzzle for many people to work out, whether in industry or in individual homes, there has been no possibility of reducing the total overall manpower estimated in the last White Paper?

THE EARL OF DUNDEE

My Lords, no. The estimated requirements of the Forces are not affected, but the Ministry of Labour have now ascertained that the numbers of men who would become liable to be called up are in excess of those requirements. The numbers of men actually being excluded from liability under this decision will be about 50,000, but of those not all would have been called up, since a good many of them would have been unfit or would not have been called up for other reasons.

LORD LAWSON

My Lords, may I ask the noble Earl whether he is aware that the statement as made does not sound exceptionally simple? Is it not possible in making these announcements to put them into a kind of 1, 2, 3 form, such as the ordinary man and the ordinary family can understand? I think there will be a multitude of inquiries following a statement made in this form, which would not have been the case had there been a simple statement.

THE EARL OF DUNDEE

My Lords, everyone who is affected will be informed individually during the next few weeks, and anybody who is uncertain should make inquiries as soon as possible from the Ministry of Labour and National Service.

LORD REA

My Lords, the decision having been made that the call-up should cease in 1960, it seems to me that this statement quite properly clears up the few remaining"scraggle-ends." I think it is proper that the Government should not enforce the call-up right up to the last day of possible call-up. I should like to congratulate them on this statement, which I find fairly simple. It does mean that fewer people will now be liable than we thought would be liable, and I hope that when the Government are scraping the bottom of the barrel they will go into these cases of exceptional hardship and, if possible, extend the deferment and bring the thing to a neat conclusion as soon as possible, which I take it is the object of this statement.

THE EARL OF DUNDEE

My Lords, I am grateful to the noble Lord for what he has said. As regards his last point, the arrangements for special hardship cases will continue as before. Of course, people whose postponement expires are always entitled to apply for an extension at the end of their term.

LORD REA

My Lords, I was suggesting that the standards of exceptional hardship might be lowered a little so as to take account of this question of postponement.

THE EARL OF DUNDEE

The officials of the Ministry are always instructed to deal with these cases sympathetically; and, of course, there is provision for appeal to an umpire.

LORD SILKIN

My Lords, do I understand the noble Earl to say that this applies to something like 50,000 men, subject to men who are omitted because of unfitness or hardship and so on, which may further reduce the numbers? If that is so, is it really worth while to bother with that limited number of men? The vast majority will have been exempt from call-up and there is a very small number of men left over. It seems to me rather hard that this very limited section who were born between June and September, 1939, who do not happen to have been exempted hitherto should be called up.

THE EARL OF DUNDEE

My Lords, we have always tried to keep a balance between the different ages of men who are called up. The number of men whose deferment does, in fact, expire between June 1, 1960, and the end of that year is about 50,000. Not all of these, of course, would have been called up. I think that what is proposed is certainly a much simpler way of reducing the numbers to the required total. It will, moreover, have a better effect on our general economy to exempt this particular group of men, which is not too large, whose deferment happens to expire in this short period, rather than to make a wider and perhaps more complicated kind of exemption.

LORD SHEPHERD

My Lords, may I ask the noble Earl where these men are going to be trained? This is the end of the line. We are now going to have a relatively few number of people. Surely it is going to be extremely expensive to train these recruits into the Forces. Are they going to be trained alongside Regular recruits, or are they to be trained separately?

THE EARL OF DUNDEE

My Lords, no. The decision to reduce the numbers does not in any way affect the arrangements of the Service Departments for the intake of volunteers and National Service recruits. The plan has always been that the National Service element in the Armed Forces shall gradually taper off until the end of 1962, and that the call-up shall cease by the end of 1960. The numbers of National Servicemen have, in fact, been getting progressively less for the last two years and would in any case continue to do so.

VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLSBOROUGH

My Lords, I know that this is rather difficult as a spot question, but could the noble Earl tell us what has been the experience of voluntary recruitment in the last three months?

THE EARL OF DUNDEE

My Lords, I feel that that is a question for the Service Departments and not for the Ministry of Labour, and I do not think it arises out of this statement. I shall have to ask the noble Viscount to put down a Question on that matter, for it is one that will have to be answered on behalf of Service Departments.

VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLSBOROUGH

My Lords, perhaps the noble Lord, Lord Carrington, could tell us what has been the experience of voluntary recruitment in the last three months.

LORD CARRINGTON

My Lords, we hope very much that the Royal Navy will get its target for this year, and there is every reason to think that it will.

VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLSBOROUGH

What of the other Services?

LORD CARRINGTON

My Lords, I am afraid that I cannot answer for Ministers of other Services.

House adjourned at twenty minutes past four o'clock.