§ [The Question was as follows:
§ To ask Her Majesty's Government whether they can give an assurance that they are, through the Paris Consultative Group or otherwise, keeping under constant review the list of electronic, precision, and automation equipment embargoed for export to China, with a view to avoiding the danger of a list consisting largely of goods in which British manufacturers are the pioneers.]
§ THE JOINT PARLIAMENTARY UNDER-SECRETARY OF STATE FOR FOREIGN AFFAIRS (THE MARQUESS Or LANSDOWNE)My Lords, I would refer the noble Viscount to the Answer that I gave to this Question yesterday, when I said that the International Embargo List is kept under constant review by Her Majesty's Government and by the other member Governments of the Co-ordinating Committee ("Cocom"). Electronic, precision and automation equipment is included amongst the items thus kept under review. The retention of goods on the embargo list must be decided on the basis of their strategic significance, and there can, accordingly, be no guarantee that the potential exports of one country may not he affected to a greater extent than those of another.
VISCOUNT ELIBANKMy Lords, I beg to thank the noble Marquess for his Answer. Is he aware that I had this Question on the Order Paper before he gave his Answer yesterday, and as I wanted to put a supplementary to this Question I left it on the Paper? Now may I ask the noble Marquess whether he is aware that Mr. Thorneycroft, a former President of the Board of Trade, on his return recently from China, said in so many words last month that the main effect of these strategic controls was to encourage greater specialisation on the part of China and the Soviet bloc; and does not this fact add to the danger to which I drew attention in my Question?
§ THE MARQUESS OF LANSDOWNENo, my Lords.
VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLS-BOROUGHMy Lords, may we be assured that, at any rate in dealing with this list, there are no other prominent national members of N.A.T.O. who are in fact dealing with the Chinese Republic in the goods which are still embargoed on our list? Can we have an assurance upon that point?
§ THE MARQUESS OF LANSDOWNEMy Lords, I am not quite sure that I have understood the question. Does the noble Viscount refer to members of "Cocom"?
§ THE MARQUESS OF LANSDOWNEI can give an absolute assurance that that is the case.
VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLS-BOROUGHMy Lords, I did mean that; but may I be quite sure also that no other member of N.A.T.O. is actually exporting any of these goods to China?
§ THE MARQUESS OF LANSDOWNEMy Lords, the original Question to which I have been replying refers only to "Cocom", and I must have notice if the question is to go outside that.
§ LORD SHEPHERDMy Lords, may I ask the noble Marquess whether there is any evidence that countries in "Cocom", are, in fact, exporting goods on the embargoed list, not direct to China but through other countries which are not members of "Cocom"?
§ THE MARQUESS OF LANSDOWNEMy Lords, I personally have no such evidence, but I should be perfectly prepared to make investigation and report.
§ LORD STONHAMMy Lords, could the noble Marquess say how this Committee reviews a product or an article which is completely new and, therefore, has not appeared on the list? What happens to some new British invention that cannot possibly be on the list, and 758 who decides that it shall be put on the embargo list?
§ THE MARQUESS OF LANSDOWNEMy Lords, I think your Lordships will recall that I said yesterday that it was sometimes necessary to add items to the list.