§ 2.26 p.m.
VISCOUNT ELIBANKMy Lords, I beg to ask Her Majesty's Government the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.
§ [The Question was as follows:
§ To ask Her Majesty's Government whether, having regard to the statement by the Chancellor of the Exchequer on April 7 that "a steady increase year by year in our export trade is the first and essential prerequisite of a sound and expanding home economy and must be our paramount aim", they will further that aim by taking such steps at an early date as have in view the ending of the embargo on the export to China of all goods which are demonstrably not of a war-like character.]
§ THE JOINT PARLIAMENTARY UNDER-SECRETARY OF STATE FOR FOREIGN AFFAIRS (THE MARQUESS OF LANSDOWNE)My Lords, it is, of course, the aim of Her Majesty's Government to give the fullest opportunity for exports. The international list of goods under embargo, which applies equally to the Soviet bloc as it does to China, is kept under constant review, both by Her 638 Majesty's Government and by the fourteen other member Governments of the Co-ordinating Committee ("Cocom"). It is naturally the aim of Her Majesty's Government to ensure that only items of strategic significance remain on the list.
VISCOUNT ELIBANKMy Lords, arising out of that Answer of the noble Marquess, for which I beg to thank him, is he aware that the present Paris procedure means that British business has less voice in deciding what articles may or may not be exported to China than its competitors; and does this not bear hardest on British firms which are interested in producing new techniques?
§ THE MARQUESS OF LANSDOWNEMy Lords, as the noble Viscount is aware, there are fourteen other countries involved in this voluntary agreement into which Her Majesty's Government have entered; and clearly, where there are fifteen countries concerned, it is unlikely that we should have a list with which each member, individually, would be entirely in agreement.
VISCOUNT ELIBANKWith great respect to the noble Marquess, that does not answer my question about the disabilities suffered by British firms who are pioneering these new techniques and who are ahead of their foreign competitors.
§ THE MARQUESS OF LANSDOWNEMy Lords, on many occasions Her Majesty's Government have answered similar questions put to them by the noble Viscount. The one consideration, as the noble Viscount is perfectly well aware, is whether or no the items have strategic significance. That is the one guiding principle; and none other.
§ LORD HENDERSONMy Lords, may I ask whether the strategic items are under continuous review; and, as they pass from being of strategic value, can they be removed from the list? Or have we to wait—I think the last reduction was last year, if I remember aright—a year, or two years, before the list is further reduced?
§ THE MARQUESS OF LANSDOWNEAs I said in my original Answer, the list is constantly under review, and as items may become obsolescent they are in fact removed from the list. But I should warn the noble Lord that it may also be that items sometimes have to be added.
§ LORD WILMOT OF SELMESTONMy Lords, will the noble Marquess bear in mind that it has happened frequently in the past that, while items are on the embargo list here, they are, in fact, supplied from Germany and elsewhere, which is not very satisfactory?
§ THE MARQUESS OF LANSDOWNEMy Lords, I say at once that Her Majesty's Government have no reason to believe that the other members of the Committee are not fully fulfilling the terms of the agreement.
§ LORD WILMOT OF SELMESTONI must ask the noble Marquess to realise that that cannot be wholly true, as I know of companies which have brought instances to his notice; and not only have they been admitted, but after that steps have been taken to remove those items from the embargo list.
VISCOUNT ELIBANKMy Lords, with reference to what the noble Marquess just said, is he not aware that in this House last year I drew attention to the fact that the West German Government had crashed through the embargo in respect of factory whaling ships?
§ THE MARQUESS OF LANSDOWNEMy Lords, both my colleagues and I are fully aware of all the observations made by the noble Viscount on this subject.
LORD REAMy Lords, I wonder whether the noble Marquess would elucidate one point? I gather from what he has said that the Government are in favour of taking out of this list all items not of strategic significance. Would he say that our other colleagues in the Consultative Committee are of the same view and are also striving towards that end?
§ THE MARQUESS OF LANSDOWNEMy Lords, I think that the noble Lord is aware that some of our fellow members are slightly more cautious than others in their approach to this matter.