§ 2.39 p.m.
§ LORD JEFFREYSMy Lords, I beg to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.
§ [The Question was as follows:
§ To ask Her Majesty's Government what action they propose to take on the question of officers' and widows' pensions, in view of the expression of the opinion of this House on the 13th of November.]
§ THE EARL OF SELKIRKMy Lords, I take it the noble Lord's Question is directed particularly to those who are already drawing pensions. As regards officers in this category the Government must adhere to the position I explained on the 13th November, namely, that they do not see how special treatment could be justified. As was, however, stated by my right honourable friend, the Minister of Defence, in another place on the 24th November, the Government are going into the whole matter of Service widows' pensions to see whether there are any valid grounds on which we could 83 reasonably justify making a differentiation in favour of this category of pensioner.
§ LORD JEFFREYSMy Lords, arising out of that reply, may I ask whether it is to be understood that Her Majesty's Government disregard the opinion constitutionally expressed by your Lordships' House.
§ EARL WOOLTONMy Lords, before the noble Earl replies, I wonder whether he could help the House by letting us know what would be the cost to Her Majesty's Treasury if they fulfilled the desires expressed in this House?
§ THE EARL OF SELKIRKMy Lords, the answer to the question of the noble Earl, Lord Woolton, was given in the Grigg Report and I gave those figures when we held the debate on this subject.
§ EARL WOOLTONI apologise to the noble Earl for not remembering the figures. I wonder whether he could tell us again?
§ THE EARL OF SELKIRKMy Lords, it is rather outside this Question and my memory is extremely fallible, but I remember something of the order of £50 million a year. With regard to the point which the noble Lord, Lord Jeffreys, made, I would say that of course we do not disregard anything said in this House. But the Government cannot act on every expression of opinion.
§ LORD DERWENTMy Lords, if I understood the noble Earl correctly, he did not state that the question of officers' pensions was being looked at again. If that is so, what was the offer he made to my noble friend, Lord Jeffreys, in the debate? When I asked that question in the debate, he was apparently unable to answer.
§ THE EARL OF SELKIRKMy Lords, I made an offer to the noble Lord, Lord Jeffreys, and the noble Lord declined it.
§ LORD DERWENTMy question is, what was the offer? Could the noble Earl tell me what it was?
§ THE EARL OF SELKIRKMy Lords, this is a little outside the Question. I do not know that the offer is relevant at the present time. The offer I made was to see whether any differentiation could be 84 made, if the noble Lord thought it could. As he did not accept that offer I presume he did not think it could.