HL Deb 16 April 1958 vol 208 cc754-6
VISCOUNT ELIBANK

My Lords, I beg to ask the first Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.

[The Question was as follows:

To ask Her Majesty's Government whether their attention has been drawn to the sale of 20,000 tons of copper wire by Chile to Russia, and whether they have any information to show that there have also been sales to China.]

THE MINISTER WITHOUT PORTFOLIO (LORD MANCROFT)

My Lords, the Chilean Copper Department announced on the 19th March that contracts had been placed for the export of approximately 16,000 tons of copper wire in 1958 from Chile to what were described as "the Eastern countries". It is understood that this total includes about 10,500 tons of copper wire for the Soviet Union and 300 tons for China.

VISCOUNT ELIBANK

My Lords, I beg to thank the noble Lord for his Answer. May I ask him whether he is aware of the variation between the quantity and the strategic controls, and that because of doubts as to receiving export licences manufacturers and exporters of copper products in this country find it extremely difficult to formulate their plans ahead?

LORD MANCROFT

Yes, my Lords, I am aware of that. There is considerable difficulty. But any exporters and manufacturers who are thinking of entering this market would be well advised to consult the Board of Trade well ahead so that they can make their plans. The Board of Trade, I know, are more than ready to offer any assistance they can.

VISCOUNT ELIBANK

My Lords, I am grateful for that answer. May I ask the noble Lord a further question? Having regard to the fact that the President of the Board of Trade, Sir David Eccles, said in another place on April 3 of this year that our policy in the review—that is, the review in "COCOM" in Paris—is to confine control to goods which are still of strategic significance, can the noble Lord now give an answer to the question put by my noble friend Lord Lucan on June 17, 1957, when he asked the noble Earl, Lord Gosford, to explain on what information Her Majesty's Government decided what is the critical level of exports after which they become strategic? Or perhaps the noble Lord would prefer that I put down a Question on that subject.

LORD MANCROFT

My Lords, I am afraid it will not make much difference whether the noble Viscount asks the question or puts it on the Order Paper. The criteria which govern the decisions taken are confidential and, so far as I know, have never been released by the Paris Group.

VISCOUNT STANSGATE

My Lords, is it not about time that this farce came to an end? Year after year we are told that this matter is being looked at and is confidential. Are the Government prepared to suggest to the appropriate authority a fundamental review of the whole policy of the blockade of China?

LORD MANCROFT

My Lords, I think that the noble Viscount's views are well known, and if he has followed the long and intricate correspondence which the noble Viscount, Lord Elibank, and I have had over the past four years, I think he will be well aware that the Government share one or two of his views.

VISCOUNT STANSGATE

My Lords, that is very comforting but not an answer to what I asked. The policy has turned out to be a failure; people drive holes through it everywhere; and I am asking whether the Government will consider bringing the whole policy matter before the appropriate authority.

LORD MANCROFT

The whole matter is before the appropriate authority.

LORD HENDERSON

My Lords, may I add this to my noble friend's question: will Her Majesty's Government bring a definite proposal before the appropriate authority that it is time to stop this embargo on trade to China?

LORD MANCROFT

My Lords, I cannot go so far as to answer that question in the affirmative, but I can reassure the noble Lord, Lord Henderson, that all these difficulties are being threshed out, and the views which have been expressed in your Lordships' House on numerous occasions are being put before "Cocom." But we do not act alone on this matter. We have Allies to consult and convince.

VISCOUNT STANSGATE

And in the meantime Chile sends as much copper as she wishes for strategic or other purposes to the Soviet Union.

LORD MANCROFT

But she is not a member of the Consultative Group.

EARL ATTLEE

My Lords, is it not about time that we stood up to the United States on this question?