HL Deb 25 July 1956 vol 199 cc202-5

2.37 p.m.

THE MINISTER OF STATE FOR FOREIGN AFFAIRS (THE MARQUESS OF READING) rose to move, That an Humble Address be presented to Her Majesty praying that the International Organisations (Immunities and Privileges of the International Tin Council) Order, 1956, reported from the Special Orders Committee on Monday last, be made in the form of the draft laid before Parliament. The noble Marquess said: My Lords, your Lordships have a debate of considerable importance coining on, and therefore I will endeavour, with the co-operation or, indeed, the connivance of the House, to deal with this preliminary matter as rapidly as possible, consistently with explaining the purpose. I am perfectly aware from previous experience that the House is, on the whole, allergic to this type of Order. But here again we find ourselves in the position that membership of this particular body, the International Tin Council, is, in the view of Her Majesty's Government, beneficial to the interests of this country and that membership of such a body entails certain obligations upon every signatory to the document which constitutes it.

The agreement for the establishment of the International Tin Council contains certain provisions under Article IV (e) 21 and 22 of the Agreement in regard to privileges and immunities. Paragraph 21 lays down that the Council shall have in each participating country, to the extent consistent with its law, such legal capacity as may be necessary for the discharge of its functions under this Agreement and paragraph 22, so far as it is relevant at this moment, lays down that the Council shall have in each participating country, to the extent consistent with its law, such exemptions from taxation on the assets, income and other property of the Council as may be necessary for the discharge of its functions under the Agreement.

The United Kingdom is a signatory to this Agreement, and it is therefore necessary to ask both Houses of Parliament to give effect to these provisions of the Agreement under the International Organisations (Immunities and Privileges) Act, 1950, which will be present to your Lordships' minds. Otherwise, of course, we should be in the position of seeking to avail ourselves of the advantages of the establishment of this Council whilst we were in default with regard to the discharge of at least part of our contractual liabilities to it. Your Lordships will recollect that an Order of this kind, by the Statute, requires an Affirmative Order of both Houses.

There are two points to which I should like to call special attention. The first is that this Agreement for the establishment of the Tin Council from which these particular privileges and immunities derive, was signed as long ago as May, 1954, perhaps before the full vehemence of your Lordships' view on this subject had become known, although it was ratified only on July 1 this year by the final signature of the last of the countries required to bring about its ratification. The second point is that the only privileges which this Order seeks to confer are concerned not with individuals but simply with the Council itself as a legal entity; and even so. these privileges are very restricted.

My Lords, the Order grants, first, legal capacity to the Council as a body corporate, which is permissible under Section 1 (2) of the Act of 1950, and, secondly, it grants to the Council as a body corporate such exemption from taxes or rates as is normally accorded to foreign sovereign Powers. The constitution of this body as a body corporate is, I think, plainly required, in order that it may properly discharge its functions; and the exemption of this body corporate from rates and taxes is on exactly similar lines to those privileges which have been extended to a good many bodies—many of your Lordships think, to too many bodies—of this kind. There is this other special point, that in this particular case the headquarters of the international Tin Council are already in London. I think it is a not unvaluable asset to this country to have the headquarters of the body concerned with this particular very important commodity established here.

My Lords, that is all I want to say as to the actual Order, but I think it is only right I should make this further reservation. It will be noted—and I have already commented upon it—that this Order is concerned only with the position of the Council as a body corporate and not with individuals. The provision which occurs. I think, in most of the other Orders, giving exemption from taxation of the remuneration of persons in the service of the Council is not reproduced in this particular Order. It is only right, however, that I should warn the House that the omission is due to the fact that some legal difficulty in extending the exemption to individuals has been encountered. owing to the exact terms of the article in the Tin Council Agreement, which did not seem to make it possible to put into operation the provisions of the 1950 Act. All I am saying now is that I think it is right to warn the House that I may at some subsequent stage have to ask for a supplementary Order to deal with the position of individuals. Your Lordships will be able to express your opinion on that if and when the situation arises. I beg to move.

Moved, That an Humble Address be presented to Her Majesty praying that the International Organisations (Immunities and Privileges of the International Tin Council) Order, 1956, reported from the Special Orders Committee on Monday last, be made in the form of the draft laid before Parliament.—(The Marquess of Reading.)

EARL JOWITT

My Lords, we all want to get on to the main debate, and therefore I shall be very short. So far as this Order is concerned, I think it is a great improvement on previous Orders. The previous Orders to which I, and the late Lord Simon before me, objected so vigorously conferred immunity upon all the individuals, which meant to say that if they ran over people with their cars, or did anything of that sort, no redress was possible to the citizens of this country. That we thought thoroughly bad, and to that type of Order I am completely allergic, as also, I believe, are a large number of other Members of this House, on both sides. This Order, as it stands at present, merely confers the capacity of corporation upon these people, and that, to my mind, is a great improvement. Be it observed that whereas to-day, if the meteorologists, or the Postal Union, come over here they get complete personal immunity, these people under this Agreement at the present time are asking for no such thing. That is a step on the right lines. I have no objection to this Order at all, but I shall object very strongly, and I hope that many of your Lordships will agree with me, if we are to be asked to extend this still further and grant personal immunity, which I think is wholly unnecessary.

On Question, Motion agreed to: the said Address to be presented to Her Majesty by the Lords with White Staves.

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