AGRICULTURAL RESEARCH BILL (Hansard, 22 February 1956)

EARL. ST. ALDWYN
My Lords, I beg to move that this Bill be now read a third time.

VISCOUNT ALEXANDER on HILLS-BOROUGH
My Lords, on the Third Reading of this Bill I should like to say just a very few words. In the first place, it gives me an opportunity, because of the contents of the Bill, of saying a word of direct appreciation of much of the work that has already been undertaken, and to express a feeling, which I find general in the industry, that we owe much to what has already been accomplished. On the other hand, I do not find anything in this Bill which would show that a greater intensity of research is being applied to certain animal diseases which are causing a great deal of worry just now. I do not mean to make a long statement on this, but I am told that those in the industry are anxious to know what are the main causes of acetoneéma and what are the remedies.
In trying to obtain some knowledge of this disease, I myself have received a great deal of help from the Agricultural Research Council, particularly from Cambridge, but I should like to feel that some special help was being given to these hard-working research people to get to grips with what is now a growing danger to our herds, especially the milk 1223 herds, which seem to be more prone to this type of disease than other livestock. If the noble Earl could give us some assurance that the Department will make a special point of having some additional work done upon this kind of disease, I should be very grateful, because I do not believe that there is any likelihood of our being able to stumble on the remedy; we must have expert work carried out by those who are engaged in agricultural research in order to make a discovery. Apart from that, all I wish to say is how grateful we are for the work that is being done in keeping close touch between the farmers and the research institutes. We hope that it will continue to expand.

§ THE EARL OF LISTOWEL
My Lords, perhaps your Lordships will allow me to say one or two words upon a point not mentioned by my noble friend and Leader. A good deal of anxiety has been expressed by the veterinary profession, who feel that the interests of veterinary research might not be furthered to the same degree as agricultural research under the auspices of the Agricultural Research Council. The feeling that has been expressed is that the Agricultural Research Council will deal primarily with diseases relating to crops, to grass and corn, and to the condition of the soil, and that diseases of domestic animals will take second place. That may be a justifiable anxiety or it may not be. Unfortunately, when this Bill was introduced in another place, this particular matter was dealt with rather cursorily owing to the ruling, no doubt entirely justified, that veterinary research did not come within the terms of the Bill. I understand that it is the policy of the Government to deal with veterinary research and research into animal diseases in the same way and under the same authorities. I think it would relieve the veterinary profession of a good deal of the anxiety that they feel at the present time if the noble Earl were to give a fuller statement than it was possible to give in another place showing the scope of veterinary research and the programme for veterinary research under the auspices of the Agricultural Research Council.

EARL ST. ALDWYN
My Lords, I assure the noble Viscount the Leader of the Opposition that we are fully conscious of a number of diseases which are 1224 proving extremely difficult to deal with and on which research work will undoubtedly take a long time. I assure him that the fact that there is no quick and simple solution is not in any way deterring us from pushing ahead with the work on these problems. Under the Agricultural Research Council all that work will be pushed ahead with the same vigour with which it has been carried on up till now.
I am sorry that Lord Listowel's mind is not yet quite at rest on the subject of veterinary research. This is only very indirectly connected with the main purpose of this Bill, but it is a subject to which we have given very careful thought. The suggestion that there should be a separate Veterinary Research Council was raised early in 1954 by the Royal College of Veterinary Surgeons, and it was decided, after very careful consideration, that it would be unwise to create a separate body. I will try to explain to the House our reasons for coming to this decision.
Work with farm animals always has to be strictly economic, and the emphasis of veterinary work in agriculture is much more on the prevention of disease than on the treatment of individual sick animals. It is therefore impossible to divorce the veterinary field from the many other fields of agricultural research. It must have the closest contact with animal breeding and genetics in order to deal with inherited diseases and congenital tendencies; with nutrition chemistry and crop production for the prevention of disorders due to dietary defects; and with work on problems of stock management and housing, changes in which can drastically affect the health of the animals and the incidence of disease.
If a Veterinary Research Council were set up, it is difficult to see how it could slop short of taking responsibility for all problems connected with animal husbandry. This would leave the Agricultural Research Council responsible for crop husbandry only and would result in a complete severance of research on stock and crop, the integration of which forms the essential basis of British farming. Such a division would be virtually impossible. It would mean that one body would be co-ordinating research on cattle and another on the pastures they graze, the crops they eat and their use in the 1225 maintenance of fertility. One body would be responsible for studying buildings for housing stock and the other for barns and granaries. One body would work on liver fluke and the other on the management of the fields to prevent its spread. It is difficult to find any veterinary problem concerned with farm animals which does not to some extent touch on general problems of farm management, the cultivation of the land and the growing of crops.
If veterinary problems concerned with farm animals cannot be divorced from agricultural research in general, this would leave for the Veterinary Research Council only work on problems connected with non-farm animals—racehorses, dogs and cats. So far, work on these animals has not been supported by the State, except in so far as funds are available in veterinary schools through the University Grants Committee. Unless it were decided to make State funds available for this purpose, a Veterinary Research Council would be in no better position to help work, other than that relating to agriculture, than is the Agricultural Research Council.
In short, veterinary research on farm animals must form part of the coordinated research on agriculture as it does under the Agricultural Research Council. The setting up of a Veterinary Research Council would destroy this co-ordination and result either in the divorce of veterinary research from other research on animal husbandry or alternatively in the divorce of research on all aspects of animal husbandry and health from the rest of agricultural research.
1226 As the noble Earl will know, there are two veterinary men on the Agricultural Research Council and I think he will agree that two out of ten scientists is quite a substantial representation. In addition, there are seven members with veterinary qualifications on the Animals Committee, which is responsible for this side of the Council's activities. The new arrangements we are making ensure that the Chief Veterinary Officer of my Department will be an ex-officio member of the Council, so I am quite sure that the veterinary interest will be well cared for. I have dealt with this subject at some length because I know that the noble Earl is concerned about it. But, as I have said, although it arises out of this Bill, it does not directly relate to the main purpose, with which I am sure the House agrees.

VISCOUNT ALEXANDER OF HILLS-BOROUGH
My Lords, I should like to thank the noble Earl for his information. So far as I personally am concerned, I wholly accept the principle of the necessity of retaining co-ordination in research into what obviously are integrated problems. The only question, to my mind, is whether the appointment of veterinary representatives is giving sufficient satisfaction to the veterinary surgeons and their professional body, and that I do not know. I just want to say that I personally accept the principle which the noble Earl has put to us.