HL Deb 11 March 1953 vol 180 cc1299-303

3.37 p.m.

VISCOUNT SWINTON

My Lords, before we go into Committee, I have now received a copy of the statement which I promised I would read to the House. It was in answer to the following Question: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs if he has considered reports alleging that General Neguib has complained of breaches of the Anglo-Egyptian Agreement on the Sudan, and if he has any statement to make. This is the statement which my right honourable friend has just made.

"I understand that General Neguib held a Press conference yesterday, in which he is reported to have made a number of allegations about breaches of the Anglo-Egyptian Agreement on the Sudan. I have asked for full information from the Governor-General on all these allegations. There is, however, one with which I wish to deal today. It has been said that we are delaying the elections in the Sudan by refusing to accept the two Sudanese members of the Governor-General's Commission nominated by the Sudanese and approved by the Egyptian Government. The facts are as follows.

"On February 25 a meeting of representatives of all four Sudanese Northern political parties voted upon the names of five candidates for the two places to be filled by Sudanese on the Governor-General's Commission. Of these five candidates, Mohammed el Hassan el Diab received three votes, I brahim Ahmen two votes, and the remainder one vote each. The parties sent the Governor-General and the Egyptian Staff Officer in the Sudan a formal letter informing them of this. On March 2 Her Majesty's Ambassador at Cairo formally proposed to the Egyptian Government the nomination of the two candidates who had received three votes and two votes respectively. So far as I am aware the Egyptian Government have not formally nominated any candidates. Meanwhile, however, the Egyptian Government have been seeking to promote the candidature of a new candidate, Dardiri Mohammed Osman, who I understand supports a closer association between Egypt and the Sudan, and one of the candidates who had received only one vote stood down in his favour. No votes have yet been cast for him by any of the Sudanese political Parties.

"It will thus be seen that Her Majesty's Government have throughout supported the wishes of the Sudanese themselves and we hold the view that, unless the representatives of the political Parties inform us that they have altered their decision of February 25, the candidates who then received most votes should be nominated. Far from any delay having been caused by Her Majesty's Government, the delay over the appointment of the Sudanese members of the Governor-General's Commission appears now clearly to be due to Egyptian unwillingness to accept the candidates proposed by the Sudanese themselves.

"I would like to add that Her Majesty's Government strongly deprecate this attempt to conduct diplomacy by means of inflammatory statements to the Press. If the Egyptian Government have complaints to make, they should be made either to the Governor-General of the Sudan direct or to Her Majesty's Government through normal diplomatic channels. I have this morning made strong representations to this effect to the Egyptian Ambassador in London, and Her Majesty's Ambassador at Cairo has also beer, instructed to do the same to the Egyptian Government.

"I would recall the statement"—made in this House on February 12 by my noble friend Lord Reading —

"to the effect that it is the resolve of Her Majesty's Government that the Sudanese shall freely decide their own future. That statement stands, and we are determined to ensure that the Sudanese shall have the right to express their views free from interference or unfair pressure from any quarter."

VISCOUNT STANSGATE

My Lords, may I ask the noble Viscount, first, when we shall have a copy of the report from the Governor-General relating to events in the Southern Provinces? Secondly, may I ask him whether this matter is likely to delay the Elections until the rainy period?

VISCOUNT SWINTON

In reply to the noble Viscount's first Question, I should be glad if he would put a Question on the Order Paper. I cannot answer a supplementary question on a matter about which I have nor the faintest idea and which concerns another Department. It does not, I think, seem unreasonable that I should ask him to put a Question on the Order Paper. As regards the second question, there has certainly been no delay on our part. How much delay is going to result from the action by the Egyptians I cannot say.

VISCOUNT STANSGATE

I did not intend to press the noble Viscount. I ask this question because it is obviously vitally necessary to have information as soon as possible about these events in the Southern Provinces. I did not ask who was responsible for the delay but whether the delay would be such as to postpone the Elections until later in the year.

VISCOUNT SWINTON

If it were possible to say how much further delay the Egyptian Government are going to impose I should be able to answer the question. As regards the other question, I have given to the House all the facts I. have at my disposal, and I will certainly give to this House—as am sure my right honourable friend the Foreign Secretary will to another place—any further information as soon as we have it.

VISCOUNT ELIBANK

My Lords, on a matter of procedure, may I ask the noble Viscount whether in the reply he gave just now he was giving a direct quotation from a Question and Answer made in another place?

VISCOUNT SWINTON

Yes. I was following the procedure which, as the noble Viscount was informed by myself as leading the House, by the Leader of the Opposition and by his own Leader the other day, is a recognised practice which has obtained in this House for as long as any of us has been here.

VISCOUNT ELIBANK

But is it not a fact that when I made a quotation recently from a Question and Answer given by the Minister in another place I was told by the noble Viscount that I was out of order? Is there one law for a Minister on the Front Bench and another law for Back-benchers?

VISCOUNT SWINTON

There is no different law for anybody in this House, but, in time, if the noble Viscount survives long enough, he will learn the very simple procedure and practice of this House. There are few rules, but one is that you do not quote from speeches made in another place unless those speeches contain a statement of policy by another Minister. It is an accepted exception, and it has also been a recognised practice, which is for the convenience and courtesy of both Houses, that when an important statement of fact is going to be made on behalf of the Government, or a statement of policy, that that statement is made concurrently and in identical terms in both Houses. I hope the noble Viscount will grasp that.

VISCOUNT STANSGATE

Is the noble Viscount aware, while he is throwing bricks at my noble friend, that my noble friend's parliamentary experience is far longer than his own?

VISCOUNT SWINTON

Not in this House, I think.

LORD STRABOLGI

Would it not be the correct procedure to arrange for someone to put a Question to the Minister?

VISCOUNT SWINTON

The normal procedure would be to put a Question, and if necessary I should be glad to make a statement.