SOCIAL SERVICES (NORTHERN IRELAND AGREEMENT) BILL (Hansard, 17 March 1949)

§ LORD SHEPHERD
My Lords, in moving that the House do resolve itself into Committee on this Bill, I wish to make a brief statement, because as this is an agreed measure and there are no Amendments to be considered, this will be the last opportunity which I shall have of making this statement. In Column 298 of the OFFICIAL REPORT, there appears a report of my speech on the Second Reading, from which it will be seen that I dealt very fully with the means to be adopted to enable the cost of social insurance in Northern Ireland to be met out of taxation raised in that country. I mentioned that the figure, although not a firm figure but a figure which had to be taken into consideration, amounted to 2½ per cent. of the total expenditure on social insurance for the United Kingdom. I then concluded my remarks upon those points with these words: The Agreement with which this Bill deals will run for three years, as provided in Paragraph 2 (iii) of the Schedule. At the end of that period it will be reviewed, and this figure of 2½ per cent. may, if necessary, be changed to meet the circumstances of the time. Unfortunately the Editor of Debates, in paragraphing my speech, parted the paragraph at the commencement of the passage I have just read instead of at the end, the consequence being that the words quoted have gone into the succeeding paragraph and have become involved with the arguments of that paragraph, and now some doubt has been raised as to whether the 2½ per cent. that I have mentioned can be altered administratively, as the Agreement provides. However, I have gone into the matter and I propose 489 to ask the Editor of Debates, as I think I am entitled to do in this case, to include the words that I have quoted in their proper paragraph, so as not to occasion any doubt whatever on the powers which are included in the Agreement.
I should perhaps add that the question of whether the share to be covered by the Northern Ireland Government shall be 2½ per cent., more or less, is determined after discussion between the Commissioners of His Majesty's Treasury and the Minister of Finance in Northern Ireland. When agreement has been reached, that agreement will be referred to the Joint Exchequer Board, which was established by the Government of Northern Ireland Act, 1920, and the Exchequer Board will decide to approve or not to approve. I mention that because it must be clear in this matter that the Agreement gives elasticity and powers of variation.
Looking at the paragraph which succeeds the one with which I have dealt, I find it desirable to make a further explanation, because under Paragraph 5 of the Agreement further powers to make adjustments in working arrangements can be made in the way I have mentioned. Bills will, therefore, not be submitted to this Parliament at such frequent intervals as they have been during the past. Indeed, it is only when proposals are made which will change the Agreement in principle or in character, requiring a new Agreement for that purpose, that the matter will be brought back to the Parliaments of the two countries for decision. With that statement, I beg to move that the House do now resolve itself into Committee.
Moved, That the House do now resolve itself into Committee.—(Lord Shepherd.)

§ EARL HOWE
My Lords, while sympathising with the noble Lord in the explanation he has just given the House, may I ask when he first discovered this? Would it not have been a good thing to have had a look through the report and to check it over, to see whether he had been accurately reported?

§ LORD SHEPHERD
My Lords, after I have made a speech of some length, I usually take the course of going down to the Editorial room to examine it, but 490 it will be remembered that my speech now referred to was made at a late hour and I omitted to do so on this occasion. I regret that very much.

§ LORD TWEEDSMUIR
My Lords, we are obliged to the noble Lord for his explanation, which clears up any misconception which may have arisen through the report of his speech.