§ LORD MARLEY asked His Majesty's Government what steps are being taken to deal with the problem of shopping for women workers in industry; and moved for Papers. The noble Lord said: My Lords, the object of the Motion which I 920 have put on the Order Paper is to draw attention to the disabilities of hundreds of thousands of women in industry in regard to the provision of time to carry out their shopping. We know that in the coming months many thousands more are going to be affected by the same problem under the new Ministry of Labour and National Service additional powers which come into force on February 22. If we analyse the lives of the women in industry we see that this is the sort of day before them. They get up at half-past five or a quarter to six in the morning. They have to get breakfast, and clean up their houses. Then they have to get to the factories by from 7 to 7.30 a.m., which is long before the shops open. They leave their work at anything from 6 to 6.30 p.m., when the shops have closed. The result is that they have no time at all to do the shopping for their households and families. What, in fact, do they do? Very often, they give up their dinner hour and slip along to the shops after five minutes spent biting at a sandwich. Then they go back to their workshops with their bags laden with butter, margarine, bread and all the rest of their ration allowances, and their bags have to stand under the bench for the remaining five or six hours of the afternoon's work. In that time, very likely, the contents of the bags are unpleasantly affected by the addition of such things as brass filings, iron filings, oil and dirt, while the heat of the factory also has its effect. That is what often happens to the food which these women buy before they can take it home and attempt to cook it.
§ The Ministry of Food, which has to-day staged in a Committee Room of the House of Commons, a display designed to show how to cook food, including extra potatoes, are wasting their time if the women who do the cooking in the homes of the people have no chance of adequately spending their money in buying food. I am going to suggest that this rushing in the dinner hour to buy food, instead of eating dinner and digesting it, is definitely affecting the health of the women workers in industry. They are tired by the time they start their afternoon's work. Moreover, the morale of the workers is affected because they feel that there is an injustice inherent in this working in factories which is not felt by those who are not so working. I believe that it is affect- 921 ing production because the women are tired through having inadequate food in the middle of the day and from the effort of rushing to do their shopping and carrying heavy parcels back to the workshop. I believe that it is affecting the man-power problem, because women are not willingly going to enter industry unless the conditions under which they work are more carefully considered.
§ I am not suggesting that the Government have done nothing in this matter. In September, 1941, the Government issued a Command Paper, No. 6310, called "Welfare work outside the factory," and they mentioned this problem of shopping. They say that Women who have taken up war work have in many cases found difficulty in buying goods. They say that that applies especially to unrationed fool supplies of certain kinds, since stocks can be bought up by women who have time to go from shop to shop during the day and to stand in queues, and they refer to methods for dealing with that problem. The question was again dealt with by the Government in November, 1941, in a reply to a Report by the Select Committee on National Expenditure. In that reply they discuss a number of plans for dealing with this very real problem. They quote Birmingham, where a number of factories make special arrangements for women to have time off once a week to do their shopping. I am inclined to think that that may be one of the best solutions. The experiment was also tried of some shops keeping open for longer hours in the evening, but that was not found very satisfactory, because sometimes women working locally did not know about it, with the result that very few people used that facility. Then they tried the plan of giving cards to women workers, giving them the right to go to the head of a queue, but that was very much resented by other women and was not a success. Finally, the Government said that the difficulties could best be overcome locally, with the help of vigorous action by all the interests concerned, under the joint initiative of the Ministry of Food and the Ministry of Labour and National Service.
§ That is why I have put down this Motion, because I think that the Government might publish a Paper giving the results of their initiative in the matter. The Government again referred to the 922 matter in the Report on "Welfare work outside the factory" in August, 1942, but that is a mere re-hash of the previous Report. The Third Report of the Select Committee on National Expenditure, issued only in December of last year, says that in many areas "shopping is still an acute problem for most women workers." The Government have had this problem in front of them for two years. They have talked about it, but it does not seem that much has been done, and I question whether the problem is really being taken seriously enough. It is all very well to say that the local authorities ought to solve the problem, but we know from the last Report of the Select Committee on National Expenditure that there was a quarrel between the Ministry of Labour and other Ministries with regard to the solution, and the result was that the local authorities were not pressed hard enough to find a solution.
§
Only last week, the Minister of Labour said that stress was being laid on the importance of planning the hours of work of individuals with some regard to their personal circumstances. I want to know whether these "personal circumstances" include the provision of shopping facilities. We are going to have women of 31 to 40 years of age directed into industry, and I want their personal circumstances considered. The Minister promised to tighten up the control of conditions before giving directions to these new women workers. I wonder whether the Essential Work Order firms have really reached a satisfactory standard in the provision of shopping facilities, and whether non-Essential Work Order firms will be induced to do so. In an article in The Times a few days ago the question is asked:
Before the Minister exercises his powers of direction, will he make an order safeguarding the conditions of employment of the persons so directed?
We want So know whether the provision of shopping facilities is going to be included in this Order. I venture to suggest that what we want now is a comprehensive publication saying what has been tried, where it has been successful, and where and why it has failed. I think we want flexibility. We want to examine the question of priority cards, the question of shops staying open later, and also, perhaps, the question of a special transferable ration book so that
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women in industry need not be compelled to do their rationed shopping at a given place. It may be a nuisance to provide that, but the war is a nuisance, and if we are going to solve the problem of war production we must take trouble.
§ Probably the best solution is, as I have suggested, for all firms to give shopping time off where other methods fail; but what is wanted is vigorous and immediate action. It is wanted in the interests of the war effort, because it will lead to greater production. It is wanted in the interests of health, because it will diminish absenteeism. It is wanted in the interests of the greatest single problem which we are facing at the moment, the problem of man-power. And, above all, we want the women in industry to feel that they are having a fair deal and that they are being treated with justice. I think that these women are absolute heroines in the way that they are working. It is amazing to see the new tasks to which they have put their hands, making shells and fuses and electrical and mechanical gear of all kinds, and working 50 to 55 hours a week. I do not think that there is too much that we can do to ease their job and to facilitate their work. I hope therefore that the Government will act and will tell the nation exactly what they are doing in this matter and so aid these women. I beg to move for Papers.
§ LORD SNELLMy Lords, my noble friend Lord Marley has introduced a question which is of very great importance, and which affects the convenience, the health and the comfort of many women who are giving essential service to the State. Let me say at once that careful consideration is being given to ways in which the problem can be met; but this is not one of those problems which can be settled by a central order, because no uniform solution is possible. The need varies very widely in different districts, and it has been found expedient to adopt local measures to deal with the conditions which exist in particular localities. Welfare officers have been advised to take action, whenever such action can be helpful, along the following lines. First, they should call a conference of representatives of the interests concerned, such as the retailers, the shop assistants, factory managers, trade unions and other 924 bodies that may be concerned in this matter. Secondly, the divisional food officers should co-operate with the welfare officers in arranging the meetings. The measures which have to be adopted depend entirely upon local conditions, but wherever it is practicable it is found that time off for women to make purchases is likely to yield the most satisfactory results. My noble friend Lord Marley rather approved of that method if it can be carried out widely and made effective. Welfare officers have been instructed to urge this as the most satisfactory solution.
§ LORD MARLEYSuppose there are no welfare officers. There are only a few firms where there are welfare officers.
§ LORD SNELLWell, wherever the welfare officers reach they have instructions to do what I have said. It may be that further welfare officers are required, and that suggestion shall be made to the appropriate Ministry. The managements which have adopted this method of time off report that it has been, even from their point of view, a satisfactory contribution to the solution of the problem. For instance, there has been a notable reduction in absenteeism, which is of considerable importance. It has also helped to improve the women's morale at their work and—perhaps most important of all —despite the reduction in working hours which such time off involves, firms report that there has been no loss in production as a consequence of affording those facilities. Among other schemes which have been widely adopted when time off cannot be arranged those most successful have been the special certificate scheme and the order and collection of parcels scheme. The certificate scheme provides employees with identity cards or discs which traders accept, and which give the holders priority. The parcels scheme is one under which traders agree to allot to married women workers, in addition to the rationed goods for which they are registered, their proportion of all released and scarce commodities which may be available. The certificate scheme has had notable success in certain districts, such as Hammersmith, where priority cards were given to 2,000 workers, and the parcels scheme in districts such as Enfield.
The late opening of shops, as the noble Lord suggested, has not been successful. In a number of towns one night a week shops were kept open late, and the experi- 925 ment was judged to be a failure. I might also say that the food control committees are helping to reduce shopping problems by granting applications from women workers who wish to transfer their registrations to more convenient retailers. The Ministry of Food also feel that the extension of rationing and the develpment of the points system have done a good deal to alleviate the difficulties of war workers, although that is not of course their primary object. These, then, are only a few of the arrangements which are made to meet the problem which the noble Lord has mentioned. The subject is constantly under review, and I will take care that the noble Lord's suggestion that a special Paper be published is conveyed to the Ministry. There is the fullest intention to do everything possible to meet the needs of these women war workers, who must not be placed at a disadvantage, because of the much-appreciated service that they are giving to the nation.
§ LORD MOTTISTONEMy Lords, before the noble Lord, Lord Marley, replies I trust your Lordships will forgive me for intervening, because we are brought into very close touch with this problem in our National Savings work. In our efforts to make the National Savings movement nation-wide, we go to all the factories and hear about all these things, and we therefore know of this very great grievance—for such it is—of women war workers who cannot get time off for shopping. Whether it is avoidable or unavoidable does not matter for this purpose. I would venture to suggest, from such information as I have for the moment, that the practical step we can certainly take, and which can be ordered from the centre, is to see that more welfare officers are appointed because, as the noble Lord said, wherever there is a welfare officer it has been found possible to arrange for time off for shopping, not only without interfering with the work, but, as we, are told by the welfare officers, actually increasing production. That seems to be the line of country, if I may use the expression, to pursue, and if I may enforce the plea of Lord Marley I would ask the noble Lord, Lord Snell, to see whether he cannot arrange that the different firms throughout the country as well as Government Departments, should appoint, even at considerable expense—for comparatively it would be a bagatelle 926 —a great many more welfare officers to cover pretty nearly the whole of industry.
§ LORD MARLEYMy Lords, I am very much obliged for that intervention, because welfare officers in the bigger firms are able to ascertain the collective desires of the women workers in industry; but of course most of the firms in this country are smaller firms and they do not have welfare officers. We might even expand the suggestion of Lord Mottistone and have travelling local welfare officers to go and visit the smaller firms and ascertain the collective desires of the women workers. The needs of the masses of these women have not yet been met, despite the efforts of the Government. I suggested a White Paper because if it were published, instead of having to refer to ten or a dozen documents to find out what the Government are doing, we should have a comprehensive Paper which would aid the firms concerned. It would tell them that they are going to gain in production, and they would then all be for time off. It would tell the workers concerned, so that they may know what to demand from the local authorities to guide them in their local action. If we published some Paper of this kind it would help everybody in finding a solution. Could not the noble Lord give an assurance that such a Paper will be published? After all, he has influence; he represents the Ministry concerned in this House. The importance of the problem has been admitted, the fact that a solution has not yet been found is admitted. Would it not be possible to say that a Paper will be published which could be circulated to all the interests concerned to help us to find a solution?
§ LORD SNELLMy Lords, with the leave of the House I can only say that the Minister must make the necessary decisions in this matter. All that I can do is to convey to the Minister what the noble Lord has suggested, supplemented by the suggestion made by Lord Mottistone.
§ LORD MARLEYI am sure the persuasiveness of the noble Lord would have an effect if there were any adamantine objection to this suggestion. I thank the noble Lord for his answer, and I beg leave to withdraw my Motion.
§ Motion for Papers, by leave, withdrawn.