WAR-TIME NURSERIES.

HL Deb 09 December 1941 vol 121 cc223-33

LORD NATHAN rose to ask His Majesty's Government what steps they are taking to meet the need for adequate provision of war-time nurseries; and to move for Papers. The noble Lord said: My Lords, against the background of the tremendous events which were the subject of a special sitting of your Lordships' House yesterday, your Lordships may, perhaps. be inclined to think that the subject of '' what to do with the children '' is almost trivial. But, unpromising though that subject may be in that setting, it has in its own setting a very special and urgent importance, and its own setting is the improved utilization of the woman-power of the nation. It has been made clear in the course of successive debates that even when the machinery of the new National Service Bill is carried into effect, the whole reserve of man or woman-power available will, to all intents and-purposes, rest upon the married women.

Your Lordships will have observed from the National Service Bill, and from the White Paper accompanying it, what is the position with regard to women. In broad terms it is this. All women under forty-one are to register. Unmarried women between twenty and thirty years of age will be liable to conscription into the Forces. All women under forty-one not so conscribed will be liable to be directed into industry anywhere; in other words they will be regarded as mobile unless they fall within one of two classes. These are the two classes. First, wives of men in the Forces or Merchant Navy; and second, women with household responsibility, which means in substance, of course, children of school age or under. If the women fall within either of these classes they are liable to be directed into industry, but only in the neighbourhood of their own homes. They will, in fact, be immobile as it were. It will therefore be clear to your Lordships that it is to these "immobile mothers," as they have been called, that the Motion standing in my name relates. Many of these" immobile mothers" have already entered industry as volunteers. Many more will doubtless do so. Others will wait until they are directed into industry under the provisions of the National Service Bill shortly to come before your Lordships' House. But in either event, whether they enter industry as volunteers or under direction, it is manifest that in practice they cannot take up work unless provision has first been made for the care of their children. This, of course, applies to children at school, and it applies with especial force to children under school age; that is to say, to those under five years of age.

This then is the problem; how to give" immobile mothers" the necessary mobility to enable them to enter industry near their homes. That is perhaps a rather cold-blooded way of putting a problem which so intimately affects the happiness and the welfare of a very large proportion of our child population and the efficiency and the happiness of their mothers, because not only can mothers not enter industry until adequate arrangements are made for the care of their children but, without such arrangements, they would, on entering industry, be neither helpful nor competent. It is essential to the morale of the married women who enter industry, either as volunteers or under direction, that they should have the completest confidence that adequate arrangements have been made for the care of their children. That is the condition precedent for the bringing into operation of this great reserve of woman-power, ultimately the only reserve that we shall have.

Your Lordships may ask what the dimensions of this problem are, and I will say frankly that I am unable to give any reliable figures; there are so many incalculable factors. It will be clear, however, that the women affected are the mothers of almost the entire child population of school age and, to all intents and purposes, of the whole of the child population under school age. I do not know whether the Ministry of Health and the Board of Education, who have the prime responsibility for dealing with this matter, have fully realized the vastness of the problem with which they are confronted. It is undoubted that the number of children of fourteen and under who may fall to be dealt with under the machinery now to be set up will be numbered not in tens of thousands or in hundreds of thousands, but in figures running into millions. Perhaps the noble Lord who is to reply will give some indication of what the Government themselves visualize as the dimensions of this problem. I suggest to him that it is a question of dealing with millions of children.

What are the measures apt. for coping with this problem? There has grown up over generations a system under which mothers who go to work arrange with their relations and friends to look after their children whilst they are at work. It is a system which has operated with a fair degree of satisfaction to all those who have been concerned; and obviously the best arrangement is that which the mothers can make for themselves with their own friends and their own relations. Under the stress of war conditions, I do not doubt that the number of instances in which those arrangements are made will rapidly increase; but it is clear that those privately-made arrangements will by no means be able to satisfy the whole of the requirements. I am aware that the Ministry of Health have recently circulated a. memorandum suggesting that local authorities should create a register of "minders." It is one thing, however, for a mother to put her child, whilst she is at work, in the care of a relation or of a friend, but it is quite another thing to suggest to a mother that her child should be taken into the home of a complete stranger.

I have no doubt that the local authority will exercise the utmost care and discretion in selecting the minders to whom these children are to be entrusted, but it is a very great responsibility that rests upon the local authority in this regard. Small children under live are brittle; and there are few who would care to face the mother of a child and tell her, a stranger, that something had happened to the child. It might not be by way of accident or the result of inattention; it might possibly result from infection in the household of the minder; there are so many difficulties and dangers that confront children, and to which children under five are particularly susceptible.

Then there is the system of nursery classes. I believe I am correct in saying that before the war the total number of children attending nursery classes was in the neighbourhood of 170,000. Those nursery classes have, I understand, been reduced considerably in number since the war, partly owing 1o the destruction or damage of a large number of schools and the reduction of the personnel available, and partly by reason of the movement of a large part of the population out of the more crowded areas. Nursery classes do afford one possible method of approach to this problem, but I believe it will be-only on a limited scale: for whereas in peace-time it is sufficient if the nursery class is open during the ordinary school hours, the problem which we are confronting to-day is the problem of how to deal with children during working hours, and not merely during the working hours of their mothers, but from the moment that the mother has to leave home in the morning until she returns home at night. It is obvious that these nursery classes would have to be open from at least 7 o'clock in the morning until 8 o'clock at night. It is doubtful whether the premises are suitable and whether staff is available, and it is doubtful also whether these schools have adequate provision for providing meals and sustenance for these children, not by reason of lack of food but by reason of lack of staff and conveniences. Certainly those conveniences do not exist at present, because in a few cases only has it been the practice for nursery classes at schools to provide meals for the children attending them; the children as a rule are taken home for their midday meal.

The only remaining solution, as your Lordships will probably believe, rests with war-time nurseries. Over a long period of years, public spirited and well-disposed voluntary bodies have been operating a system of day nurseries and nursery schools, and during war-time those two systems have been amalgamated into a single system of war-time nurseries. Too much cannot be said in praise of those public-spirited bodies and 01 the voluntary work which has been done over so long a period; but it has been done from the point of view of child welfare, and I am asking your Lordships to consider the matter to-day not from the standpoint mainly of child welfare but as an economic problem, as a problem related to the better utilization of our woman-power. Your Lordships may perhaps think that in these circumstances it would be desirable that the use of war-time nurseries should be limited to the children of mothers who are themselves going to work. Hitherto they have been equally open to the children of mothers who have not been going to work, but who have felt it convenient and pleasant that their children should go to these nurseries and schools. Perhaps the noble Lord who is to reply will indicate whether it is the Government's intention that priority of entry into these war-time nurseries should be given to the children of mothers who are in industry.

The number of the war-time nurseries which the Ministry has at present in contemplation is of course increasing, but perhaps the noble Lord in his reply would indicate what is the programme over successive periods. It has been stated publicly that the number of war-time nurseries already opened or likely to be opened by the early part of next year is 500. These 500 war-time nurseries are designed to take an average number of forty children, that is, 20,000 children in all. That at present, as far as has been made public, is the whole programme in contemplation by His Majesty's Government. I cannot believe that the Government have not some extension in mind, and I think that your Lordships would be interested to know exactly what that extension may be; for provision for 20,000 children is a drop in the ocean.

For a variety of reasons I am not in a position to give any global statistics—figures are difficult to obtain—but even global statistics are misleading, because they depend on such considerations as calling up and geographical distribution. But I happen to have the figures for the City of Birmingham. In the City of Birmingham there are 50,000 children under the age of five, and I think it is no exaggeration to suggest that of those 50,000 children at least 20,000 may be the children of mothers who, either as volunteers or under direction, will enter industry in the near or distant future. The whole of the provision, so far as is known to the public, to be in contemplation by His Majesty's Government for war-time nurseries would be fully absorbed by the City of Birmingham alone.

The provision of war-time nurseries must be considered, not in hundreds but in thousands. I suggest to the noble Lord—and I believe it is an under-statement—that at least 200,000 children will have to be provided for by war-time nurseries after every other resource has been exhausted; that figure is a minimum. The Government's own figure for the average number of children in war-time nurseries is forty, which means that 5,000 nurseries will have to be provided, as against the 500 now in contemplation. That involves a great survey being made, accommodation being provided, and staff being trained, and it would be interesting to know from the noble Lord what exactly are the arrangements which the Government have already made for a survey on that great scale, for the training and provision of a staff and for the provision of equipment; because special kinds of equipment are necessary. Have the Government made adequate arrangements so far for provision, as needed, of the special kinds of furniture required for small children, and for other nursery equipment such as toys, kindergarten equipment and the like, necessary for children under five?

But it would be a great mistake to think that the problem is satisfied by providing war-time nurseries for the day-time. The mothers are not all going to work in industry during the day. Many of these mothers will be directed to night shifts too. It is essential therefore that provision should be made for the accommodation of those children at night, and it is no answer to say that the children for whom provision has to be made at night can be at home with their mothers during the daytime, because during the day-time their mothers will be sleeping, resting before the next night shift begins. It follows that where the mother is working during the day-time, day-time nurseries are sufficient, but where a mother is working at night, even though only for a short period of days or weeks, provision must be made for the child for the whole twenty-four hours, and that involves residential nurseries, with all the additional responsibility, the more complex organization, the fuller equipment and more experienced staff that are implied. It also involves questions relating to hospital accommodation, because, as is well known, infection spreads among young children like wildfire, and there must be some provision for dealing with those cases.

It is not only a question of those under five for whom provision must be made. What about the children aged between five and fourteen? What about the children actually at school? Play centres will have to be extended. Provision for the children from five to fourteen must be made for the night no less than for the day. What arrangements do the Government contemplate as regard? children of school age during school holidays, when their mothers are at work? It is no less than a problem of providing adequate accommodation for all the children under fourteen of those mothers who either volunteer for industry or are directed into industry under the present limited arrangements contemplated by the National Service Bill and the White Paper. It is also a question of provision for the vast number of children when those temporary limitations are withdrawn, as withdrawn before this war is over and as the strain increases undoubtedly, in my submission, they will be. It is a great social problem with which His Majesty's Government are confronted, it is a great industrial problem and a great administrative problem with which they are confronted, and upon its right solution depends not merely the best use of the woman-power of the nation in industry—woman have already done splendidly, and they are prepared to do far more—but the health and the happiness of the generation for which this generation is fighting. I beg to move.

LORD SNELL

My Lords, my first duty is to assure the noble Lord that the question which he has raised is very welcome to the Government, who recognize its very great importance, not merely as he has suggested, as an industrial and administrative problem, but essentially as a human problem. We all have some responsibility in regard to the welfare of these children. If the system is entirely voluntary a great part of the responsibility falls upon the mothers, but in so far as it is a compulsory system the responsibility must rest upon the Government and the local authorities. His Majesty's Government therefore recognize the subject as being one of importance and urgency and of peculiar general interest.

Perhaps your Lordships will allow me for a few moments to indicate how the need has arisen and how provision has grown. The provision for war-time nurseries was, of course, stimulated by the needs of the evacuated children in reception areas. That is where the matter really started. Also, the Government have encouraged the provision of these institutions wherever mothers have been on war work. The extent of the need is very difficult to estimate, and I am afraid I shall not be able to give to my noble friend the detailed figures and estimates for which he asks. The difficulty, of course, is to estimate:, first of all, the extent to which women's labour will be drawn upon, and also the difficulty of various provisions that have to be made. The Government, however, have recently given special attention to all these needs, and it is safe for me to assure the noble Lord that the problem is being worked out in a satisfactory way. The urgency appears to lie in those key industrial districts which may call for quite rapid development, and that includes all the services for child welfare. The need in particular districts which I need not specify, and ought not to specify, may indeed be intense, and may grow quite suddenly, but we cannot at present estimate the full dimensions of the problem.

The noble Lord has suggested that the ultimate problem may be that of millions of children, but the figure for current thought he mentions as some 200,000. His Majesty's Government cannot know, first of all, the number of married women who will be called into industry, nor can they estimate the number of their children, but the Minister of Labour has estimated that a figure of 1,000,000 married women may be available to us in the next twelve months. I am not suggesting that the figures given by the noble Lord are exaggerated, because no one at present can really estimate what the figure will be; but the Government's answer to this anxiety is that we must first of all observe the rate of intake into industry and then try to provide for nurseries in sufficient numbers in accordance with that intake. It would be, in the Government's view, unwise to fix in advance any number, which would depend on the rate of intake and on the efficacy of any alternative methods that may be tried. Instructions have, however, been given to local authorities designed to ensure adequate preparation for the expected need and to be ready for quick development. The three Departments concerned—the Ministry of Health, the Ministry of Labour and National Service, and the Board of Education—are collaborating closely with a view to the adequate treatment of this difficult and urgent subject, and there is also collaboration between maternity and child welfare authorities and the local education authorities, with a view to securing full success for this work in the shortest possible time.

Special instructions have been issued to local authorities encouraging them to prepare for rapid action. Also, in areas where the need is urgent and exceptionally acute, personal letters from the three Ministries concerned have been sent to the mayor or chairman of the local authority. The result of these various activities is that at the end of November the nurseries in operation were 194, and those approved but not yet in full action numbered 209, providing for something over 15,000 children. There were in active preparation a further 264, and the Government feel, with their present knowledge of the need, that this programme is, on the whole, a fairly satisfactory one.

LORD ADDISON

May I ask whether the 209 represented an addition to the 194?

LORD SNELL

Yes, the total number is 403. Then there is the question of distribution. It is obvious that, first of all, the districts likely to have this problem in an acute form must take precedence. Of the 125 nurseries approved in November, 33 were allocated to the Midland area based on Birmingham; 20 to the industrial districts of Lancashire, and 17 to the outer London districts where this demand was likely to be more acute.. For the quick results that are hoped for in the development of this work, three factors are essential. The first is the premises ready for occupation, the second is the question of staff suitable for the work to be done, and the third is the equipment suitable and adequate to the task. If your Lordships think first of all of the question of premises, it so happens that these districts where the need is, or will be, greatest are exactly the districts where the demand on building accommodation is also the greatest. That is a factor that must be taken into account in estimating just what the Government can do. But in order to try to meet that situation 500 huts have been ordered to supplement the buildings available. There is also the problem of the materials available and the labour problems concerned, but that work is regarded by the Government as being of special urgency, and it will take priority over other things.

Then, in regard to the staff, it must be remembered that a suitable staff must include a certain number of trained nurses and teachers for the purposes of supervision and so on, and these can be supported by a large number of girls and women for general purposes, and a scheme of training for such supplementary labour has been worked out. I think the Government would like to commend to young women service of this kind, most useful to the nation at this period and also in all probability most useful to themselves in their after life. As to equipment, special arrangements have been made to meet this need. A list of articles has been prepared and orders for their provision have already been placed, Therefore, to summarise, let me say that in these various ways it is hoped that these arrangements will result in meeting the need. If the need develops to the proportion suggested by the noble Lord, that will not catch the Government by surprise, because the Government will observe the intake of women into industry, and will watch the problem grow and at the same time try to meet it.

I have dealt in this detail with the question because it is a matter of recognized importance and because the provision of war-time nurseries is a part of the special object of the Motion put down by the noble Lord. May I say further that a most valuable contribution can be made to the solution of this problem by individuals? Many already act as foster mothers to children whose mothers are at work, and whilst there are dangers to be apprehended, such as those referred to by the noble Lord, on the other hand there may be, and probably will be, very many cases where a child would be benefited rather than otherwise by being taken into the house of a kindly foster mother. The Government hope to see this greatly increased, for it would be a most valuable contribution to the general war effort, and the local authorities will give every facility for suitable arrangements to be made. This work would represent a valuable partnership between voluntary people and Government, and it would confer social benefits of great importance. To conclude, these children must, in some way, be cared for, especially now that war work for mothers is no longer a matter of free choice. Women have already shown that they will do their part, and the provision for the care of their children which the Government have made, or are making, will relieve them of very many anxieties. I again thank the noble Lord for raising the question which is so timely and at the same time so important.

LORD NATHAN

My Lords, I desire to express my appreciation of the care and detail with which my noble friend has been good enough to reply to the Motion that I have moved. I must, now-ever, say quite frankly to my noble friend, not only on my own behalf but on that of the noble Lords who sit upon these Benches, that they cannot consider the answer which the noble Lord has given as satisfactory either as regards what is being done now or what is in contemplation. Your Lordships must, I think, have noticed that whereas I felt the figures which I gave as being within the contemplation of the Government were modest and conservative, the actual figures given by the noble Lord in his reply of provision for 16,000 children is very much less than the least I had reason to contemplate. But the matter which must have stirred the minds of your Lordships most was the noble Lord's statement that the intake would be observed and that His Majesty's Government would take the necessary steps in the light of their observations. That may be, and very likely is, a sound policy if this matter were being dealt with as one of child welfare in a scheme of social readjustment, but this is not the case here.

There is a problem of getting women into industry. Now, to get married women into industry you must not only have a factory, but you must also make adequate provision for their children. You may have factories with the best equipment in the world and mothers willing to go and work in them, but unless the accommodation for their children is there, not whilst the intake is being observed, but even before the intake begins to operate, then you may just as well have no factory at all, because provision for the children is the inescapable-condition precedent for these mothers going into industry at all. I hope that the noble Lord, in view of this discussion, may find it possible to direct this matter to the notice of those Departments of His Majesty's Government concerned with the subject, with a view, possibly, of modifying the procedure which he has suggested in the direction that I have indicated, so as to ensure that steps will be taken in advance of the intake and not lag behind it. I beg leave to withdraw the Motion.

Motion for Papers, by leave, withdrawn.