Lords Sitting of 28 September 1939

Preamble
The House met at three of the clock, The LORD CHANCELLOR on the Woolsack.

TRANSPORT FUEL SUPPLIES.
3.5 p.m.
THE DUKE OF MONTROSE THE DUKE OF MONTROSE rose to call attention to the fact that while restrictions are properly being made in respect of the limited amount of petrol available for transport purposes, the Government do not appear to be taking adequate steps to develop alternative fuels or means of propulsion; and to move for Papers.
The noble Duke said: My Lords, I hope in moving the Motion which stands in my name that you will acquit me of any intention to cause worry to those who hold responsible positions in these anxious days, but there are some matters concerning the defence of the country and the successful prosecution of the war that deserve serious consideration. One of those matters is the question of transport—transport both for the civil population of this country and for those business interests which are doing so much to back up the efforts of the fighting forces. The question of transport raises the question of petrol, which is essential for a large proportion of our transport, and the question of petrol raises the further question whether we are utilising to the fullest extent alternative fuels which are indigenous to this country. It stands to reason that the more alternative fuels which are indigenous to this country can be used the more petrol there will be available to allocate to the fighting forces. We all know that without petrol the Air Force of this country, the mechanised Army of this country, and to some degree the Royal Navy, would be worth very little more than steel junk. Therefore it is essential that we should, as a war measure, have as much petrol as possible to allocate to the Defence Forces.
The claims on transport and the use of petrol-driven vehicles are increasing. Owing to the congestion on the railways, due to Government transport and defence measures, road haulage is growing. We want haulage on the roads for all kinds
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of heavy traffic, for the carriage of livestock, the carriage of fertilisers, the carriage of feeding stuffs, bricks, cement, wood, and all that kind of merchandise. We also require petrol not merely for transport but for agricultural production. Much of our agriculture to-day is wholly dependent on mechanised means of cultivation. Tractors want petrol. Just as the claims and demands on petrol grow and grow so does the supply become less and less. We have just had our first restriction of the petrol allowance—a 25 per cent. restriction. If we are in for a three-year war is there any noble Lord who will say there will not be a still further restriction? It surely stands to reason that until we have the undisputed mastery of the air and the undisputed command of the sea, and until all possibility of attacking and sinking our oil tankers is over and past, nobody can say that the restriction on petrol will not grow more and more.
Seeing the possibility of further restriction of the petrol supplies, I want to ask what we are doing to provide the supply of an alternative fuel and an alternative method of propulsion which is indigenous to this country. My information may be very small, but my impression is that we are doing very little indeed, either through the Government or through private enterprise, to make good these restrictions on petrol. Yet there is no reason at all why we should be doing nothing. Fortunately for us, a number of countries on the Continent have demonstrated during the last few years that producer gas propulsion applied to motor vehicles for the purpose of converting them from petrol to gas can be made perfectly efficient. Germany has done an immense amount of work with producer gas motor vehicles. I have seen figures showing that to-day she has nearly 10,000 gas motor vehicles working day and night on her roads. France has 7,000 gas producer vehicles, Italy has 3,000, and I know that in Australia they have just fitted 600 agricultural tractors. Therefore there is ample evidence that producer gas propulsion is no longer an experiment; it is a fact of proven possibility. Still more fortunately for us, it has been demonstrated on the Continent that producer gas applied to motor vehicles works best with heavy vehicles like buses, lorries and such like engaged in long-distance haulage.
I want to emphasize that it is not an experiment. A little while ago I happened to be a pioneer in introducing the Continental system of gas motor propulsion, because I visualised the day when we might be short of petrol in the event of war. Although my humble effort was very limited by small means and short time, yet after eighteen months there are now to-day 200 gas producer motors of all kinds running on the roads in Great Britain. What is stranger is that these 200 vehicles are not operated by or owned by private individuals, but by some of the leading and largest industrial firms in the country. I know one bus company in the Highlands of Scotland which has been operating a twenty-two-seater bus for over a year. That bus has run over 50,000 miles in daily service on the Highland roads. So great has been it's success and so pleased are the directors with its performance that they have now ordered a thirty-two-seater bus. I saw that bus run its tests about a fortnight ago, and on a part of the road it was able to attain a speed of forty-two miles an hour. Then I have seen a large motor lorry of twenty-two tons weight on the road, which has run several thousands of miles in Lori-don. I have seen lorries of three, four and five tons weight working on the road, all of which have done several thousands of miles. I mention these figures simply to show your Lordships that gas producer propulsion for the conversion of petrol lorries is not an experiment but a fact.
My little office, since this 25 per cent. reduction in petrol, has been simply besieged by people wanting to know what a gas producer is, where you can get a gas producer, what can be done with it and so on. If I were in a position to do so I should place an order for 1,000 gas producer vehicles to-morrow, and not for individuals, but for some of the largest manufacturing firms in the country, working for the Government and for the railways. Yet what can I do? Nothing, for the simple reason that the conversion of petrol lorries to gas propulsion is not considered to be war work. It is not munition work, and therefore, because it is not war work and not munition work, I cannot get material. I cannot even retain the key staff. Therefore nothing is done, and I have to say nothing is done. It is a ridiculous position. We have any amount of fuel in this country suitable for this gas propulsion. I have
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tried anthracite coal, which is very suitable. Then there is smokeless coal, which is being made in this country; that is suitable. I have tried wood charcoal, charcoal made from hard woods—oak, beech and birch; that is suitable. I have tried conifer charcoal made from Scots pine; that is suitable. I have tried peat charcoal made of peat from the bogs of Ireland; that is perfectly suitable. Therefore our supply of alternative fuel for gas propulsion is unlimited and unrestricted, and the more we use solid fuel the more petrol there is to allocate to the fighting forces.
Take smokeless coal: there is near Nottingham a group of collieries that are about to complete our smokeless coal factory; it should be completed at the end of this month. They expect to be able to make 150,000 tons of smokeless coal in a year. I dare say a great proportion of that smokeless coal will be utilised for domestic purposes. But suppose there were an emergency, suppose we were in a difficulty, and suppose we wanted oil: if that 150,000 tons of smokeless coal were utilised for gas propulsion in motor lorries, it would give the power equivalent to that of 4,000,000 gallons of petrol. Would it not be useful to be able to hand over 4,000,000 gallons of petrol to the Air Force and the fighting forces and be able to carry on your transport just the same without any restriction on the public use? Surely it would be. And not only with that smokeless coal but also with all the other fuels I have named you could release petrol for the fighting forces. Germany is doing it, France is doing it, why do we not do it? Simply because the Government, obviously, do not make it munition work, and so forth. Some noble Lords in this House have been public-spirited enough to offer their services to various Ministries. My humble services are very small, but in order to get the thing done, in order to get the scheme begun, in order to be able to give more petrol to the fighting forces, I am ready to place my humble services at the disposal of the Ministry of Supply. I beg to move the Motion which stands in my name.
3.19 p.m.
LORD TEYNHAM: My Lords, I should like to take this opportunity, as President of the Transport Producer Gas Association, of giving my support to His Majesty's Government for the research

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work which they have already carried out on the various alternative fuels for transport purposes. In early days I think there was a certain lack of collaboration between the fuel research station at Greenwich and the industry generally, but I can assure your Lordships that the position is now entirely changed and His Majesty's Government have made arrangements to pool all their knowledge and resources with industry and the Coal Utilisation Research Association, which is carrying out all the research work. I understand that the research is being directed to the production of a gas producer plant which can be fitted to lorries and heavy vehicle traffic, and also to the design of an engine to make the best use of producer gas, instead of just adapting a petrol engine. I think that the key to the whole problem is close co-operation between the producer research organisation and the actual motor manufacturers.
I would like to make clear to your Lordships that, in spite of what has been said by the noble Duke, one of the main difficulties to contend with is the fuel supply, as at the present time only a limited supply of suitable fuel is available for the producer gas plants which are at present operating on a number of vehicles. I understand it is the intention of the research organisation to study the production of a producer which will be able to use a far wider range of fuels, including steam coal and low-temperature coke, and thus widen the basis of the fuel supply. I think your Lordships can rest assured that every effort is now being made by the fuel research station of His Majesty's Government at Greenwich, in co-operation with the Coal Utilisation Research Association, to produce at the earliest possible moment a really suitable design of gas producer which will help to safeguard our petrol supply in the present emergency.
3.22 p.m.
EARL FORTESCUE: My Lords, in the last few days we have grown familiar with several alternative forms of transport. Our streets are populated with bicycles and pedestrians, and I am glad to hear that the horse is once more coming back into its own. But what my noble friend has in mind, as he has told us, is the development of certain devices to enable existing vehicles, which ordinarily run on petrol, to continue to operate.
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This is a very technical field, one in which I cannot possibly speak with the expert knowledge of the noble Duke and I hope that the House will, therefore, bear with me. Somewhat different issues arise in connection with each of the different possible alternative fuels, and I will therefore say a word about each in turn.
First of all about compressed gas. An alternative system for using town gas for vehicles is to carry it under high pressure in cylinders. This, of course, gives a much bigger radius of action than gas bags. The Government have been taking a considerable interest in this matter for some time, and in particular they have been closely associated with tests on compressed gas vehicles under operating conditions. I understand that the results show that the use of compressed gas in cylinders is a practical and efficient means for operating transport vehicles. The difficulty as regards the development of compressed gas is that the capital equipment required is not inconsiderable. The House will well understand that the large cylinders of special steel which are required are unfortunately in great demand for other essential purposes at the present time. In addition to the supply of cylinders elaborate gas compressing plant would be necessary at a large number of centres before compressed gas transport could be developed on any scale. The position, therefore, is that, while the Government are most anxious that everything possible should be done in this field—as is shown by their association with the experiments which I have mentioned—the relative importance of different demands on the available manufacturing facilities must be considered.
The second matter is creosote. Large quantities of creosote are produced annually by the carbonisation of coal at gas works, coke ovens, and low-temperature plants. A good deal of this material is used as a fuel oil, and fortunately considerable quantities are available. Then I want to say a few words about gas bags, which a good many of your Lordships may remember were bags containing ordinary town gas, which billowed on the top of vehicles in the last war. These gas bags are probably the simplest means for converting vehicles from petrol, but unfortunately the amount of gas which can be contained in a bag of this kind is relatively small.

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However, as a means of propulsion for the vehicles operating over a restricted radius, gas bags may prove to be of some value. Elaborate technical research does not appear to be necessary, and it is understood that the matter has already been taken up commercially. For their part the Government are making it clear that coal gas used for transport purposes will not be subject to rationing.
As regards the producer gas which the noble Duke mentioned, I may say that an alternative field much in the public eye at the present time is the use of this so-called producer gas. As has already been explained this means in fact carrying a generator with a fire inside, the gas from which, sometimes called suction gas, is sucked into the engine and then ignited like petrol gas. These producers use solid fuel, that is to say, anthracite coal, charcoal or certain kinds of coke. The noble Duke has been interested especially in vehicles built for the use of producer gas. Although many efforts have been made in peace time to develop this commercially, development has been slow. This may be taken, I think, as indicating that the technical and other problems involved are not free from difficulty, Even in France, often held up as an example in this matter in this country, there are only a few thousand vehicles running on producers, notwithstanding the considerable official encouragement, and the availability in large quantities of that excellent producer fuel, charcoal. The aspect of this problem which would give more immediate relief would be the conversion of petrol using vehicles to the use of producer gas, but the technical difficulties in this respect are probably greater than those referred to already, while the use of coal, coke or low-temperature semi-coke, instead of charcoal, brings new difficulties.
The Government have been endeavouring for some time to find a solution to these problems, and those engaged on the work hope that it will be sufficiently far advanced to enable the Government to make a statement within a relatively short time. The noble Lord need not fear that the Government are not fully alive to the necessity for adopting every device in war time which will reduce the demand for an imported article by the use of a home produced article or As derivates. Circumstances may well dictate that such methods should be adopted in wartime
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although, in peace time, they may not be economical, and it is from this angle that the use of coal to reduce the importation of petroleum is being attacked, and will be prosecuted with vigour.
THE DUKE OF MONTROSE: My Lords, I am very much obliged to the noble Earl for the very informative reply he has made, and I am much encouraged in understanding that the various Ministries of the Government do not look upon this gas producer propulsion system as purely experimental. The only thing is that if anything is going to be done it should not be left too long. It takes time to organise the manufacture and production of gas producers, and it takes time to organise and collect the various fuels and distribute them throughout the country. If we are going to do anything it should be begun now. I do not think I need pursue the matter, in view of the information that has been given, and therefore I beg leave to withdraw my Motion.
Motion for Papers, by leave, withdrawn.

FOOD PRODUCTION.
3.31 p.m.
LORD HARMSWORTH LORD HARMSWORTH asked His Majesty's Government what plans they have for increased food production in this country; and moved for Papers. The noble Lord said: My Lords, in raising this question this afternoon I have no desire to make a speech of any length. My one desire is to obtain from the Government a compact statement, if they will be so good as to provide it, as to what they are doing in the matter of home food production. I follow this question with great interest, but I find some difficulty in doing so because such intimations as are given to us appear only sporadically in the Press, and perhaps by way of answers to questions in Parliament. I think it is of the first importance that Parliament should know what the Government are doing, and what they intend to do. For it cannot be doubted that this question of home-grown food is almost as important as those major questions that usually occupy the attention of your Lordships' House.
It may be due to inadvertence on my part, but I am not aware at this moment whether there is in existence a Food Production Department comparable to that which achieved such astonishing results

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during the last war, under the energetic direction of my noble friend Lord Lee of Fareham. The results achieved in homegrown food production during the last war, I say, having regard to the circumstances of the case, may be regarded as astonishing. I have extracted one figure from the record of the War Cabinet of that period. It relates to production in England and Wales in the year 1918. In respect of wheat we achieved the highest record since the year 1884; in oats the highest record by 21 per cent. ever recorded; and in potatoes an increase over any record of 25 per cent. And that at a time when labour was short and there was immense difficulty in getting together the machinery requisite in modern agriculture and in fertilisers, and indeed, you might say, in regard to everything that goes to the production of food in this country.
I may give as an instance of what I have called the sporadic notices that appear in the Press the appeal a few days ago of the President of the Board of Education to headmasters of elementary schools in this country to encourage their pupils in the cultivating of garden plots. But I think there is another element in the community which is almost as important as the allotment holders, I refer to the enormous number of people who have gardens which are perhaps not fully cultivated, which could be cultivated more for the production of food, and which could be enlarged in a great number of cases by taking in a portion of a field or of a park, and laying it down to food cultivation. If I may venture to trouble your Lordships with the statement, I may say that, anticipating trouble this autumn, at my small country cottage I took in a patch of ground about as big as your Lordships' House for the production of potatoes, and in addition to my ordinary produce I had about a ton and a half of the most splendid potatoes that I have ever seen. That kind of thing could be done on an immense scale all over the country; so much so, I think, that in many of our semi-rural areas and our wider suburban areas householders could provide enough vegetable food for the whole of their communities. I may give another curious example of what was done in food cultivation during the last war. A friend of mine had a house on the top of Campden
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Hill, with an unusually large garden. In that garden in one of the years of the war he produced no less than three tons of potatoes.
It seems to me, if I may say so, that there is need for a statement from the Government, and I would say an appeal from the Government, especially to those residents in suburban and semi-suburban areas to whom I have specially referred. I believe that by stimulating this kind of cultivation there would be a very large addition to our supplies of home-grown food, and—what perhaps is almost as important—there would be the enlistment of myriads of willing hands in what they would regard, and what should be regarded, as work of national importance. I need not stress the great importance of beginning now what it is proposed to do in this matter. We are fortunate, I think, in the respect that there are still before us months of time in which the kind of cultivation I am thinking of can be taken in hand, but there will be, and there must be, all the questions of the necessary materials, and not least the supply of seeds, for the major agricultural operations and for those minor operations to which I have referred, to be settled.
If my noble friend can give me an answer to another question I shall be greatly obliged to him. I would ask him: Have the restrictions on potato growing and the growing of other necessary crops in this country been suspended? Because I venture to suggest that if they have not they should be suspended forthwith. They were established, I believe, for the purpose of equalising the market and preventing the market in those commodities from being flooded from abroad. There is very little prospect of any market in this country being flooded from abroad as this war progresses. The time may come, indeed, when I think we shall be only too glad to receive cargoes of potatoes and other produce grown in foreign countries. I have nothing further to say, but I should like to be permitted, if I may, to congratulate the noble Lord the Parliamentary Secretary on his appointment to one of the most interesting Departments of State, and at this time one of the most important, and one with which incidentally I have myself many happy associations. I beg to move.
3.40 p.m.
THE EARL OF GLASGOW: My Lords, I am all in agreement that this question is a very important one. There is one point I would like to make, if your Lordships will bear with me. Your Lordships know that food controllers have been appointed in all counties, and your Lordships also probably know that county councils have been asked to stop all housing schemes. These housing schemes are being stopped, but in many cases the land has been bought and the contractor has not yet started work. This land is now awaiting the time when houses will be built on it. I suggest that the Government should give some encouragement to local authorities to grow potatoes on that land, which now belongs to them, and so increase the food production of the country.
3.41 p.m.
THIS PARLIAMENTARY SECRETARY OF THE MINISTRY OF AGRICULTURE AND FISHERIES (LORD DENHAM): My Lords, in rising to address your Lordships for the first time in replying for the Government, I ask for your indulgence, more especially since it was only a week ago to-day that I took up my new post as Parliamentary Secretary of the Ministry of Agriculture. I could have wished for some longer time in which to have made myself more thoroughly informed in order the better to present a clear case to your Lordships and be able to answer any questions that may arise. I am very grateful to my noble friend Lord Harmsworth for having given me notice yesterday of the subject he was going to raise, and, if I may, I will answer straight away, as well as I can, the questions he has asked.
As regards the Food Production Department which existed in the last war, there is not going to be, as far as I am aware, any Department of that nature. My noble friend will see why if he listens to the scheme of my right honourable friend the Minister which I propose to propound in a minute or two. As regards what he called the sporadic notices which have so far appeared in the Press and elsewhere, the statement that I am about to make will also answer that question. I would refer my noble friend to the broadcast which my right honourable friend the Minister made on September 4, in which he dealt very clearly with the plans of the food campaign, broadcasting
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as he did not only to farmers, but to the general public, and showing not only what were the schemes which he had in mind, but also that the whole of these schemes had already been prepared on the day after the outbreak of war. I am asked as to whether the restriction on the growing of potatoes has been lifted. I have not had an opportunity of refreshing my memory about that, but I think I am right in saying that all the regulatory powers of the Potato Marketing Board will be suspended as soon as the potato plan of the Minister of Food comes into operation.
Now, if I may, I should like to try and give your Lordships a short account of the campaign which my right honourable friend the Minister has initiated to increase the food supplies of the country. There are two cautions I would stress before I start. First of all, as your Lordships will know, I can only answer for the Ministry of Agriculture, which deals with England and Wales and not with Scotland; and, in the second place, the Ministry of Agriculture cannot reply through me to questions which affect either the Ministry of Food or the Ministry of Supply. Most questions as to prices and the regulation of prices affect, as I shall show, the Ministry of Supply or the Ministry of Food far more than they directly affect the Ministry of Agriculture.
Let me first of all say a word as to the extent to which this country is better off or worse off to-day to meet the exigencies of the times than we were in the last war. I would claim that in five respects this country is better off to-day. In the first place, owing to the amazing growth of the sugar-beet industry, we have to-day a very large supply of home-grown sugar which did not exist in the last war. Secondly, I am able to assure your Lordships with regard to the livestock position that our cattle, sheep, pig and poultry populations are above the 1914–18 figures to-day, when the war is just starting. In the third place, I shall have to say a word or two in a minute about the question of man-power, but it is all to the good of agriculture and of the farmers generally that in this war we start with all men of twenty-one and over in a reserved class and therefore not liable to be called up for the Fighting Services. Fourthly—and this is a very cheering factor—there is to-day a vastly increased number of

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tractors available, as I shall show, and that is a very important matter when a ploughing scheme is just starting. Lastly, I am sure of this, that I can claim that the very fact that the Ministry of Agriculture and my right honourable friend have got all their plans in being, having prepared them all before the war so as to put them in motion right from the very start, is going to be a factor which will be to the advantage of agriculture and of farmers generally all over the country. If any of your Lordships ask me whether we are worse off in any respects, I should say we are perhaps worse off in two respects. In the first place, it is a fact that at the time, not very long ago, when the £2 subsidy scheme for ploughing-up started, there were some 3,000,000 fewer acres under the plough in this country than there were at the end of the last war. The second factor which is against us is that undoubtedly the number of agricultural workers has considerably decreased, though this, of course, in a sense and to a certain degree is offset by the mechanisation of farming.
With these preliminary remarks, may I turn to the food production campaign itself? The primary object, of course, as your Lordships know, is to plough up a further 1,500,000 acres. I am now dealing first of all with the ploughing-up scheme. All the plans have been made and, as I mentioned just now, my right honourable friend broadcast to the country what these plans were. Farmers have been asked to plough up 10 per cent., if possible, of their grassland, and it is hoped that this may be finished by the spring of next year in order that the results may be available for the 1940 harvest. As regards crops to be sown, the best crop of all, where it can be sown, is wheat, and the following other crops are also recommended: Potatoes and certain fodder crops, including barley and oats. But my right honourable friend is very anxious to emphasize to the farmers of the country that while wheat holds priority of place, it would be a thousand pities to infer from that that the Minister wants wheat at all costs. He does not do anything of the sort. On any land which obviously is not suited to wheat the Minister wants to be grown the best crop that can be grown, and wheat should be grown only where wheat can give the
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best yield. The subsidy of £2 an acre which was started some time ago is a plan that is working well. The date, as your Lordships know, has been extended from October 31 to December 31, and already at the Ministry there have been notifications to show that no less than 260,000 acres have been covered, which is not a bad start.
As I said just now, at the end of the last war there were 3,000,000 acres more under the plough than there are to-day, so what in fact the agricultural community is being asked to do is to remedy half that deficit by putting a further 1,500,000 acres under the plough. As to the methods to be adopted, my right honourable friend has based his own method upon two schemes. One is the scheme of decentralisation, in that he does not believe in farming from Whitehall. The other is the vesting of all the necessary powers in the local people who live in the countryside, who know the areas, and who can bring to bear all their experience on their particular problems; in fact it is local knowledge and experience which he wants to be harnessed to the great task that lies before us. It was therefore immediately on the outbreak of war that the Minister set up in every county in England and Wales a county war agricultural executive committee, and I know that some of your Lordships are playing very leading parts in those committees.
The Minister has delegated to them all the necessary powers, and in order to get co-ordination between the various counties, and incidentally also to help these county committees who will have only just started their work, he has arranged for his Parliamentary Private Secretary, Mr. Cedric Drewe, Mr. Gavin, a well known agriculturist, and Mr. Anthony Hurd constantly to travel round and visit the county committees in order to co-ordinate the work of them all, and, above all, to help them by advice whenever that advice is required. These county committees have themselves set up sub-committees which will deal with such questions as cultivation, machinery, labour, livestock, feeding stock supplies, drainage, and insects and pests. Above all, the county committees will each of them be told what is the quota of this 1,500,000 acres that will be required from each county. Once they know that they can

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then travel round farm by farm and decide what contribution should be made by each farmer. Although there are compulsory powers it is hoped that these compulsory powers will not be needed. The county committees will also help to allocate the share of any available supplies there may be of labour, feeding stuffs and fertilisers.
It is quite obvious that a great new scheme like this cannot be set in operation without difficulties being experienced and many complaints being made. I would like to say a word or two about the difficulties that have arisen and that may arise, and the way it is hoped they may be met. First of all there is bound to be a shortage of labour. Here I would say that under the able guidance of Lady Denman there is a Women's Land Army now in which nearly 30,000 women have been enrolled, although not all of them have yet been interviewed. Of those that have been enrolled and interviewed some 700 are in training institutions and there are very many more training on individual farms. It may interest your Lordships to know that a national wage has been fixed of 28s. where a woman is over eighteen years of age, and of 22S. 6d. where she is under eighteen years of age, and any farmer who gives board and lodging may deduct either 14s. or 12s. 6d. according to the age of his lodger. I am sorry to have to confess to your Lordships that at the moment this Land Army is not being much used. I am, however, convinced that it is a valuable alternative supply of labour, and I believe that it will be quite true that in a short time, when, for instance, the twenty-year-old class of Militia is going to be called up and when in fact farmers do not perhaps get back from the Fighting Services all the men for whom they have applied, this Women's Land Army may come into its own, and may provide a valuable source of labour. But, as I said, I think the House should realise that in the main agriculture has been well treated in that everybody who is twenty-one or over is in the exempted schedule and will not be called up for the Fighting Services. I should like to add that that applies also to occupations essential to agriculture, such as the manufacture of agricultural machinery, artificial manures and feeding stuffs.
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Now I come to the second difficulty that is certain to arise, and that is the shortage of tractors. But I want at once to acquaint your Lordships with one very joyful fact, and that is that there are no fewer than 60,000 tractors to-day in farmers' private hands on the farms, whereas in the last war there were only sixty. It is a marvellous thought that here we are starting a new war with a thousand tractors for every one we had in the last war. In addition to that the Ministry have a supply of some 1,500 tractors, and they will be available for county committees as and when the need arises. The Ministry also are taking every step they can to secure new tractors, and I should like to add a special tribute to the Ministry of Mines for the way in which they have met farmers already over the question of diesel and petrol supplies for these tractors. The Ministry of Mines have enabled farmers to draw supplies freely without the necessity of having to fill up the ordinary form with which your Lordships will have become familiar. With regard to implements generally, steps are being taken to increase the supply of ploughs and other farming tackle, and it is hoped to distribute the first allotment before the end of September.
I come now to fertilisers and I will deal first of all with potash. There was bound to be a shortage of potash. We have something like two-thirds of a year's supply in the country, but I am informed that the main supplies of potash come from Germany, so it is little to be wondered at, if the war goes on, that we should run short of potash. But alternative supplies are being looked for elsewhere. The supplies of sulphate of ammonia should be sufficient if the factory at Billingham goes on functioning as it did before the war. With regard to superphosphates the supply may be short, but there are some reserves in hand, and as to lime and basic slag I am able to say that supplies should be adequate.
Next I come to feeding stuffs, about which there have already been many difficulties and a good many complaints. Trade has been held up in regard to feeding stuffs owing to the diversion of cargoes which were coming to these shores. For instance, a ship would be making for Liverpool and it would be

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diverted to Cardiff. Obviously that means at once a dislocation of traffic, as well as increased costs. There has also been great uncertainty as to the future prices of feeding stuffs, but on September 3, the day that war broke out, a price-fixing order was issued the aim of which was to peg down the price of feeding stuffs to the highest prices that reigned in the week before war broke out. Actually this price-fixing order did not succeed. It led to an almost complete standstill in trade, because costs were still rising and the suppliers refused to sell; so now a new order is being made by the Ministry of Food and I hope will shortly be signed. This new order will also peg down the maximum price to the highest price at which feeding stuffs were sold in the week before war broke out, the week ending September 2, and it should succeed where the other failed, because the Ministry of Food are arranging for the release at the port or the mill of most feeding stuffs at prices which will enable these maximum prices to be observed and not exceeded.
May I say just a word about prices generally? The Ministry of Agriculture are, of course, consulted at every stage by the Ministry of Food and by the Ministry of Supply. The Ministry of Agriculture will at any time take up, and will be only too willing to take up, any specific complaints that may reach them from individual farmers on the question of price, but the responsibility actually lies with the Ministry of Food alone, or, for such things as fertilisers, with the Ministry of Supply. I want to assure your Lordships that my right honourable friend the Minister and the Ministry both realise how vital is the importance to the farmer of getting his raw material as cheaply as possible.
Now I want to say a word or two about the Ministry's policy of getting as quickly as possible some cash into the pockets of the farmers. At this time that is particularly desirable and the Minister realises this. Farmers are now being paid the additional payments under the Agricultural Development Act, passed in July this year, on land that was under oats and barley in 1938 and these payments are going out from the Ministry to more than 42,000 farmers at the rate of 3,000 a day. As to the wheat subsidy, the first advance payment will be made about the middle
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of October, and in regard to the £2 per acre subsidy on land ploughed up, payments will start at the beginning of October.
Let me turn to the question of allotments. I said in the case of ploughing up land that my right honourable friend the Minister knew that decentralisation and the vesting of sufficient powers in the local authorities was of importance. In exactly the same way that is considered important in regard to the question of allotments. The aim is to have produced another 500,000 allotments, and if this is successful it will bring the figure of allotments up to the number of 1,330,000, which was the peak figure of the year 1920, shortly after the last war. But the whole scheme depends upon decentralisation and upon the vesting of the necessary powers in local authorities and in the county committees. In order to attain this end a circular letter was sent from the Ministry of Agriculture on September 18 to the London County Council and to the councils of boroughs and urban districts in England and Wales, giving them power under the Defence Regulations of 1939 to take possession of unoccupied land, and, with the consent of the owner and occupier, of occupied land, for use as allotments. I ought to add that if it is desired to take common land the consent of the Minister himself must be obtained.
Rent is payable in the case of occupied land as agreed with the owner and occupier, provided it complies with the provisions for payment of rent made under the Cultivation of Lands (Allotments) Order, 1939. Councils should arrange as far as possible that the expenses of providing land, including rent, should be recouped by payments made by the cultivators, and it is anticipated that in most cases this will be done, but any deficiency will be met by the Ministry, provided that, apart from any sum which may in certain circumstances be payable for restoration of the land, it does not exceed a total sum of £2 an acre. Local authorities are already empowered under the Land Settlement (Facilities) Act, 1919, to provide seeds, plants, fertilisers and implements at cost price to allotment holders where no facilities exist for buying from a society on a co-operative basis. Crops which must and ought to be encouraged are those of high food values, such as potatoes and carrots, and

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the use of these allotments for grazing has been prohibited accordingly, although poultry keeping may be allowed by a council.
As your Lordships will realise, and as my noble friend Lord Harmsworth pointed out, there is, and will be, a great demand for advice, and the Minister has asked councils to arrange for expert help to be given to cultivators in the preparation and cultivation of their plots. It is hoped that the co-operation of professional gardeners and nurserymen will also be secured. The Ministry have prepared and will circulate shortly a special leaflet dealing with the best vegetables to grow and how to grow them. Noble Lords will realise from what I have said that local authorities have been given exceptionally wide powers in regard to these allotments, and that they themselves will use all their vast local knowledge to bring the scheme to success. This has been done to enable them to carry on independently of Whitehall, independently as much as possible of the Ministry of Agriculture, because they are clothed with all the necessary powers.
Now may I turn to the question of gardens, about which my noble friend Lord Harmsworth specifically asked me questions? With regard to the use of gardens for production of food it is obvious again that very many who have them will want advice as to how best to use their gardens, and so a circular letter of September 19 was sent to county councils urging them to set up horticultural committees in all urban areas with a population of over 20,000 so as to help food production in allotments and private gardens. These committees will have available the skilled advice of the Ministry's horticultural inspectors who will travel round and see that they get all the advice they need. Again leaflets and bulletins are in course of preparation and will be distributed as soon as possible. In addition there are going to be itinerant lecturers travelling all over the country to give the best possible advice. A further circular letter dated September 21 was sent to every county war agricultural executive committee throughout England and Wales giving instructions about horticulture and as to how orchards and gardens can best be used by changing over from the production of luxury crops to the production of food crops, and at the same time, of course, preserving the
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necessary valuable stocks of bulbs, plants, etc., which will be needed after the war.
It may occur to many of your Lordships that here, above all, is a case where films can come in useful and the Minister of Agriculture realises that to the full. Steps are being taken to procure films for the guidance of those who want this information and the Minister is in close touch with the Ministry of Information on the matter. Both as regards allotments as well as garden produce very useful information can surely be given. I am informed that if a man uses his allotment properly he can there grow for himself, his wife and two children two-thirds of the year's supply of vegetables. That can be demonstrated with films and much useful information given.
Summing up, then, my right honourable friend feels that he can look to the great farming community, to the county war agricultural executive committees, to local authorities and to allotment holders, present and prospective, as well as to the owners of gardens, to put every ounce of energy that they possess into the great task which lies before them. So best can they help not only the country but also themselves and their families. It is too early yet to know what success is meeting the plans of my right honourable friend, but I do claim that those plans have been well and truly laid and prepared, and I only hope that a successful result will be their reward.
4.10 p.m.
LORD DARYNGTON: My Lords, I should like to take this opportunity of congratulating the noble Lord on his maiden speech from that Bench. I have had the opportunity of being in Parliament for over forty years, and I think it was one of the best maiden speeches to which I have ever listened. I had the privilege of knowing him in the House of Commons, where he was a very popular member, and I am sure we were all delighted to hear his speech to-day and hope that he will many times address us in future. I should like to refer to one point: boy labour. We might well take advantage of the feelings of boys at the present time in trying, if possible, to get them to work on the land. Among a very large number of boys in public and other schools of the country there is a very keen desire to do what they can for the country at this time. I hope

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very much that the Minister will, as far as possible, encourage them.
4.12 p.m.
LORD SNELL: My Lords, it is not my intention to enter into any comments upon the general theme, but I should like to take the opportunity of congratulating an old colleague in another place on his first Ministerial speech. When I knew him in another place I rarely agreed with him and I never quarrelled with him, and I have a very special pleasure in congratulating him upon his performance to-day. I have another reason for doing so, because I passed through a similar experience. Within a few days of my coming to your Lordships' House I was compelled to defend the policy of His Majesty's Government on India, a highly controversial subject; and I do not know that I ever had a more terrifying experience, but with your usual generosity your Lordships overlooked my shortcomings. The noble Lord who has just spoken to us on this important question has handled it with great efficiency and with complete clarity, and the whole House, I am sure, will welcome his appearance as Minister at that Box.
4.14 p.m.
THE MARQUESS OF CREWE: My Lords, I merely desire to add a few words to express the pleasure with which I have listened to the statement made by the noble Lord opposite. We all regret the resignation of his predecessor, who, as we know, worked hard and well as representative of the Ministry of Agriculture. That regret, however, almost disappears in view of the satisfaction with which we welcome the noble Lord opposite and the enjoyment with which we listened to his extremely lucid and full statement of the difficult position which the whole agricultural world recognises to have been brought about by the war. I was particularly impressed by what the noble Lord said of the advantages of decentralisation in this matter, particularly with reference to the ploughing order which has been issued. Undoubtedly in the course of the last war a good deal of grassland was ploughed up which had better have been left alone, which was really less suitable for plough than for pasture. I feel, however, that now this is not likely to happen. Under the care of the county committees it will be seen that only suitable
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land is put under the plough, and, as we all know, there is a great deal of land which has really tumbled down to grass and would be infinitely better for being ploughed.
We were all, I am sure, impressed by the gigantic figures which the noble Lord gave of the production and existence of tractors in comparison with the past. That is a great satisfaction, as it facilitates the movement to an extent which is impossible to exaggerate. At the same time I hope that the horse will not be entirely forgotten. A good deal of land, as your Lordships well know, cannot properly be worked by tractors, and there our old friend the Shirehorse or Clydesdale can do the work more cheaply and more efficiently.
I was greatly interested in what the noble Lord said about the encouragement of allotments. It so happens that in the part of the world in which I have lived and owned property I have had a great deal to do with allotments, and I thoroughly recognise the enormous advantage they are, not only from the point of view of supplying food but also from that of the moral advantage which the people derive from their existence. There must now undoubtedly, even more than in the last war, be a great deal of unoccupied barren land—land not ripe for building, in or outside the suburbs of the great towns—which might most profitably be put to early cultivation. If it is possible to conceive any sort of advantage or benefit arising from this terrible crisis, that is the kind of consoling thought which can be considered to give a certain mitigation to the circumstances in which we live. On the whole I am sure that your Lordships will feel that the statement the noble Lord has made is an encouraging one, and I feel certain that the entire agricultural world will put all its energy and its best ability into assisting the work of the country.
4.20 p.m.
LORD HARMSWORTH: My Lords, I am exceedingly grateful to my noble friend for his very able and comprehensive statement, and it is abundantly obvious that your Lordships in general share my obligation to him for it. I beg your Lordships' leave to withdraw my Motion.
Motion for Papers, by leave, withdrawn.

COURTS (EMERGENCY POWERS) (SCOTLAND) BILL. [H.L.]
THE LORD CHANCELLOR (VISCOUNT CALDECOTE): My Lords, I beg leave to present a Bill to confer on Courts of Scotland certain powers in relation to remedies in respect of the non-payment of money and the non-performance of obligations (including powers in relation to bankruptcy and winding-up proceedings), and to make provision for purposes connected with the matters aforesaid. I move that the Bill be now read a first time.
Moved, That the Bill be now read 1a.—(Me Lord Chancellor.)
On Question. Bill read 1a, and to be printed.

EXECUTION OF TRUSTS (EMERGENCY PROVISIONS) BILL. [H.L.]
THE LORD CHANCELLOR: My Lords, I beg leave to present a Bill to facilitate the execution of trusts during the period of the present emergency; and to move that it be read a first time.
Moved, That the Bill be now read 1a.—(The Lord Chancellor.)
On Question, Bill read 1a, and to be printed.

BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE.
THE LORD PRESIDENT OF THE COUNCIL (EARL STANHOPE): My Lords, in addition to the business which appears on the Paper for next Tuesday, which is the Second Reading of three Bills—I understand my noble and learned friend will probably also put down the Second Reading of the two Bills which he has just asked your Lordships to read a first time—and a Motion by Lord Strabolgi with regard to the British cinematograph
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film industry, I understand that a statement will be available from His Majesty's Government, and the Leader of the Opposition has been good enough to say that he will put down a Motion on the Paper asking for that statement to be made. It will therefore come after the Second Readings of the Bills on the Paper and Lord Strabolgi's Motion. I therefore suggest that we meet at three o'clock, and the statement will come at about four o'clock, or a little after. The Bishop of Winchester has also put down a Motion with regard to juvenile welfare, which may also lead to a debate, and so we may have a fairly long sitting for that day. We shall meet again on Wednesday, if noble Lords wish to debate the statement, and possibly also on Thursday to take the Third Readings of the Bills which we shall read a second time on Tuesday. The other place, I understand, meets on Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, and possibly on Friday of next week, but that is not yet settled.