UNEMPLOYMENT INSURANCE (No. 2) BILL. (Hansard, 5 February 1930)

§ LORD PARMOOR

My Lords, I beg to move that the Commons Amendments be 467 now considered. Before that Motion is put, it might be convenient, I think, to follow the procedure which was followed the other day and for me to say the one or two words I have to say on the matter as it stands. I think the noble Marquess will agree with me that that is a convenient way of proceeding. The position is that the Government have given very careful consideration to the situation which arose on Monday in consequence of the decision of your Lordships to insist on the Amendment introducing a time limit and certain Amendments consequential thereon. We have been very desirous, I am sure I am very desirous, of meeting fairly both the dignity and powers of your Lordships in dealing with this question.

The Reason given by your Lordships for insisting on Monday last on the time limit Amendment to which the Commons had disagreed is in these terms. The terms are important because they show the matter which was raised:— Because they consider that, before passing permanent legislation it is desirable that opportunity shall be afforded to Parliament for further examining questions relating to unemployment insurance. It will be seen that the objection raised was that before passing permanent legislation they desired further opportunity for considering legislation of this character. To meet this Reason, the Government proposed in another place, and I hope your Lordships will consider, what I should call a wise compromise. By "a wise compromise" I mean a compromise conciliatory without any concession of principle, so far as I can follow it, on either side. The Government desire, as I believe all your Lordships desire, that the Bill should be passed as soon as possible for the benefit of the insured without any period of intervening difficulty. When I make that statement I recollect specially the words used by the noble Marquess opposite [the Marquess of Salisbury] as to the desirability of dealing with social questions, which he said he regarded as quite essential. I do not question that.

The proposal of the House of Commons was not the deletion of the time limit, but its extension to a later date, June 30, 1933, the reason being that this would allow the administrative machinery to be adjusted reasonably 468 and efficiently, and that this time limit might be adequate to gain some experience. I do not think that this Amendment can be said in any way to impinge upon the dignities and the powers of your Lordships. It is a practical Amendment in order that we may get on to the very important business, the limitation of the time. The one year could not be accepted for reasons which I am not going into in detail, but which I will summarise. Firstly, it will take several months, perhaps nearly twelve months, to carry out the administrative changes required by this Bill, and at the end of a year it will not have been possible to have had practical experience of its working. That is the information that is derived from the Department. Secondly, if a new Bill had to be passed about twelve months hence it would have to be prepared at least three months in advance, so that little or no experience could possibly have been gained. Thirdly, some parts of the Bill do not come into operation immediately—for instance, those relating to young persons—and could not have been in operation at all at the time the year had expired. Fourthly, from an administrative point of view, it is most undesirable to complete the year on March 31, and the date proposed by the Government, June 30, is much more desirable.

Therefore, the effect of the Government proposals is to give a two years extension, and at the same time to alter the date to June 30, which, for administrative purposes, is much more convenient. I do not think I need say more except to commend the Amendments which have been made in another place. The terms of the Amendments are before your Lordships, and also the Reasons which have been sent up from the other House. I very sincerely hope that all talk of a crisis, if I may use such an expression, has passed away, and that in the practical way which has made the success of English administration and English life we shall deal with this matter on a business basis. It gives your Lordships the principle which I think you desire, and at the same time gives an adequate extension of time. I have nothing more to say. I hope your Lordships will, when the time comes, accept the Amendments of the House of Commons.