§ Audit of Accounts of County and Town: Councils.
§ 14. In the application of this Schedule to the accounts relating to education of a county council or of a town council of a burgh being a county of a city the follow- 964 ing modifications and provisions shall have effect:—
- (a) References in paragraphs 8, 9, and 10 to the Secretary of State shall be construed as references to the Scottish Education Department;
- (b) Notwithstanding anything in this Schedule—
- (i) The accountant of the Department may also, by demand in writing, require the production before him of all the accounts of any such council relating to education and of all books and documents which he may deem necessary for the purpose of examining the said accounts, and shall have the same powers as the auditor with reference to requiring the appearance before him of any person, the production of any books or documents and declarations as to the same, and the provisions of paragraph 4 of the Schedule so far as relating to penalties for neglect or refusal or making an untrue declaration shall apply as in the case of a requirement by the auditor;
- (ii) If it shall appear to the accountant of the Department that any payment included in the said accounts is in his opinion contrary to law or that any sum which in his opinion ought to have been is not brought into account by any person he shall report thereon to the Department, setting forth the grounds of his opinion, and the Department shall cause such report to be intimated to the officer of the council or other person concerned with the payment or the failure to bring into account and also to the council, and shall give such officer, person, or council an opportunity of submitting representations thereon, and if the Department agree with the accountant they shall cause intimation to be given to the council and to the officer or other person concerned and also to the auditor that in the event of any expenditure of the same nature as any such payment as aforesaid being incurred by the council after the date of such intimation or of any similar failure by the council to bring any sum into account after such date it shall be the duty of the auditor to make an interim report with respect thereto;
§ In this paragraph the expression "accountant of the Department" has the meaning assigned to it in section twenty-three of the Education (Scotland) Act, 1908.
§ VISCOUNT YOUNGER OF LECKIE moved to leave out paragraph 14. The noble Viscount said: This paragraph provides for a second audit of education accounts, after the whole of the county council accounts, including the education Accounts, have been fully audited by a chartered accountant appointed by the 965 Secretary of State for the purpose. There seems no justification for a double audit.
§
Amendment moved—
Page 79, line 1, leave out paragraph 14.—(Viscount Younger of Leckie.)
THE EARL OF AIRLIEThis Amendment is based upon the misconception that "double audit" is involved in the Government proposals. On the contrary, any such danger has been carefully avoided in the scheme that has been framed. It does not involve any duplication, not indeed any substantial change in the procedure which has been effectively in vogue for many years. The professional auditor will be concerned mainly with questions of correct accounting, vouchers, instructions, and so on. The accountant of the department will be mainly concerned with scrutiny for legality and conformity to the various minutes and orders of the Department. The two will co-operate to achieve that complete review of the accounts which is considered essential, having regard to the complexity of the educational scheme of administration. Since 1918 an almost similar system has been in operation, for each authority has appointed a cash auditor who has co-operated in just this way with the Department's accountant. The cash auditor has certified the accounts correct on the ordinary professional lines, and has then forwarded them to the Department's accountant, who, after the necessary examination for legality, has given the final certificate. The proposals now put forward have received the cordial approval of the officers of the Edinburgh and Glasgow town councils as a result of formal conferences with them. The Chamberlain of the city of Edinburgh said explicitly that he welcomed the continuance of the departmental inspection of the accounts. I regret, therefore, that we are unable to accept the Amendment.
§ VISCOUNT YOUNGER OF LECKIEThen there is really no double audit, but only an official inquiry into the accounts.
§ Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.
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§
Amendment moved—
Page 79, line 18, leave out the second ("the") and insert ("this").—(The Earl of Airlie.)
§ On Question, Amendment agreed to.
§ Third Schedule, as amended, agreed to.
§ Fourth Schedule:
§
Amendment moved—
Page 80, line 16, leave out ("the grants heretofore") and insert ("grants").—(The Earl of Airlie.)
§ On Question, Amendment agreed to.
§ Fourth Schedule, as amended, agreed to.
§ Fifth Schedule:
§
Amendment moved—
Page 80, line 31, after ("in") insert ("respect of").—(The Earl of Airlie.)
§ On Question, Amendment agreed to.
§ Fifth Schedule, as amended, agreed to.
§ Sixth Schedule:
§
Amendment moved—
Page 85, line 17, after ("apportionments") insert ("(exclusive of any sums paid out of moneys provided by Parliament to make good a deficiency in any such apportionment)").—(The Earl of Airlie.)
§ On Question, Amendment agreed to.
§ Sixth Schedule, as amended, agreed to.
§ Seventh Schedule agreed to.
§ Eighth Schedule:
§
Amendment moved—
Page 87, line 36, column 3, leave out ("hereinafter") and insert ("hereinbefore").—(The Earl of Airlie.)
§ On Question, Amendment agreed to.
THE EARL OF AIRLIEMy next Amendment also is drafting, and repeals three sections of the Roads and Bridges Act, 1878, which provide for districts within counties and are inconsistent with the scheme.
§ Amendment moved
§ Page 87, line 45, at end insert:—
| ("41 & 42 Vict. c. 51. | The Roads and Bridges (Scotland)Act, 1878. | Sections eighteen twenty-seven and twenty-nine. |
§ On Question, Amendment agreed to.
§ Amendments moved—
§ Page 88, line 11, leave out ("twelve") and insert ("and twelve. In subsection (2) of section sixteen, paragraph (c). Sections")
§ Page 89, leave out lines 23 to 25.
§ Page 91, leave out lines 21 to 23.—(The Earl of Airlie.)
§ On Question, Amendments agreed to.
§ Eighth Schedule, as amended, agreed to.
§ Title:
§ An Act to transfer to county councils and to the town councils of certain burghs in Scotland functions of existing local authorities relating to poor relief, lunacy and mental deficiency, education, public health, and other matters; to amend the law relating to local government in Scotland; to grant relief from rates in the case of the hinds and heritages in Scotland to which the Rating and Valuation (Apportionment).let, 1928 applies; to discontinue grants from the Exchequer for certain purposes in Scotland and to provide other grants in lieu thereof; and for purposes consequential on the matters aforesaid.
§ THE EARL OF AIRLIE moved, after the second "Scotland," to insert "to extend the application of the Rating and Valuation (Apportionment) Act, 1928, to lands and heritages in which no persons are employed." The noble Earl said: The object of this and the following Amendment is to permit a clause to which your Lordships have agreed to be included in the Bill, amending the Rating and Valuation (Apportionment) Act, 1928.
§
Amendment moved—
Line 7, after ("Scotland") insert ("to extend the application of the Rating and Valuation (Apportionment) Act, 1928, to lands and heritages in which no persons are employed").—(The Earl of Airlie.)
§ On Question, Amendment agreed to.
§
Amendment moved—
Lines 9 and 10, leave out ("the Rating and Valuation (Apportionment) Act,
968
1928") and insert ("that Act").—(the Earl of Airlie.)
§ On Question, Amendment agreed to.
§ Title, as amended, agreed to.