HL Deb 15 April 1919 vol 34 cc325-30

Order of the Day for the House to be put into Committee, read.

Moved, That the House do now resolve itself into Committee.—(The Lord Chancellor.)

LORD ARMAGHDALE

My Lords, before we go into Committee on this Bill I should like to ask a question as to the Royal Irish Constabulary. I understand that it is in contemplation to stop all promotion to the higher ranks of the force and to reduce the number of county inspectors and district inspectors. I believe that this step is being urged upon the Irish Government by the Treasury against the advice of the Inspector-General of the Constabulary. I think we are entitled to ask for some explanation on the subject. Some of your Lordships no doubt saw in the Press on Saturday last that a Proclamation has appeared stating that several counties in the South and West of Ireland are in a state of disturbance and require an additional establishment of police. This does not seem to me to be the time when it should be in contemplation to reduce the number of officers in the Constabulary, and I hope that we shall have some explanation from the Government that will tend to allay the dissatisfaction which this report has caused.

THE LORD CHANCELLOR

My Lords, my noble friend will not have failed to observe that the very important matter to which he has drawn attention has no direct relation to the scope of this Bill, and it would, I think, have been convenient if he had given me notice that he intended to raise it, in order that I might, if possible, have come armed with the necessary information. The convenient course, I think, even now would be that my noble friend should give notice that he will ask this question.

On Question, Motion agreed to.

House in Committee accordingly.

[The EARL of DONOUGHMORE in the Chair.]

Clause 1:

Amendment of Criminal Injuries Acts.

1.—(1) The provisions of the Criminal Injuries Acts with respect to the compensation of persons maimed and of the representatives of persons murdered in certain cases, shall, subject to the modifications made by this section, be extended so as to apply in any of the following cases, namely:—

  1. (a) Where a magistrate, police constable, member of the naval, military, or air forces or the civil service of the Crown has been murdered, maimed, or maliciously injured in his person in the execution of his duty or on account of his being, acting or having acted as a magistrate, police constable, or member of such forces or service:
  2. (b) Where any other person has been murdered, maimed, or maliciously injured in his person, and the murder, maiming or injury is a crime arising out of any combination of a seditious character or any unlawful association.

(2) An application for compensation in pursuance of this section may be made at any time within three months after the murder, maiming, or injury, or, where the murder, maiming, or injury occurred before the passing of this Act, within three months after the passing of this Act, and any preliminary notices required to be served by or in pursuance of the said Acts may be served at any time not later than seven days before the making of the application.

The application may be made in the case of murder by the personal representative or any of the next-of-kin of the deceased, in the case of maiming or injuring by the person maimed or injured, and in any case by the Attorney General for Ireland or any person authorised in that behalf by him, and any compensation awarded in the case of murder shall be paid or distributed to or amongst such person or persons in such manner, shares, or proportions as the county court judge or judge of assize determines.

The application may be made either as against the council of the county in which the murder, maiming, or injury occurred or, at the option of the applicant, as against that council and the council or councils of any neighbouring county or counties, and in that event any compensation awarded may be apportioned by the county court judge or judge of assize as between the several county councils in such proportions as he thinks proper.

(3) The power of a county court judge or judge of assize to fix the area off which the compensation is to be levied shall include power to fix any one or more townlands or parishes, or sub-denominations thereof, as the area off which the compensation or any apportioned part thereof is to be levied, and to exempt from the levy any specified hereditaments within the area, and his power to make a decree for such sum as he thinks just and reasonable shall include power to make a decree for full compensation.

(4) Where a decree is made against a county council on any such application the amount recovered against the council shall be payable by the council on demand, and the payment thereof may be enforced under subsection (1) of section eighty of the Local Government (Ireland) Act, 1898, whether the amount has or has not been raised or levied.

(5) The power to make rules of court for the purposes of section five of the Local Government (Ireland) Act, 1898, shall extend to the making of rules of court for the purposes of this section.

(6) This section shall not apply except whore the murder, maiming, or injury occurred on or any time after the first day of January nineteen hundred and seventeen.

(7) In this section the expression Criminal Injuries Acts means the enactments specified or described in Part I. of the First Schedule to the Local Government (Ireland) Act, 1898.

LORD ORANMORE AND BROWNE

I beg to move Amendments of which I have given the noble and learned Lord on the Woolsack private notice. I am sorry that I was unable, owing to the Bill being proceeded with rather rapidly, to hand them in in time to be printed and circulated. My first Amendment is in Clause 1, subsection (1) (a), after the words "Where a" to insert "judge". As the paragraph reads at present it states— (a) Where a magistrate, police constable, member of the naval, military, or air forces or the civil service of the Crown has been murdered, maimed, or maliciously injured in his person in the execution of his duty— and so forth. I propose to put in, before the word "magistrate," the word "judge". I am told that judges are included in paragraph (b) in "any other person." I think your Lordships will agree with me that it is hardly a very dignified position for the high judicial authorities of the Crown, from the Lord Chancellor downwards, to find themselves in a sort of omnibus subsection. It is quite evident from the newspaper (quoted by the noble and learned Lord yesterday) which is published in connection with the Sinn Fein movement, that it intends specially to attack them, because in the last issue of that paper I see it is stated that— In particular, any policeman, judge, warder, or official, from the Lord Lieutenant downwards, must be made to understand that it is not wise for him to distinguish himself by undue zeal in the service of England in his opposition to the Irish Republic. I hope the Government will agree that it is advisable to make this Amendment.

Amendment moved— Clause 1, page 1, line 10, after ("a") insert ("judge").—(Lord Oranmore and Browne.)

THE LORD CHANCELLOR

I have no objection to this Amendment. I think it was in fact covered, as the noble Lord indicated, but I can quite see his point that he would like the judicial person to be mentioned by name.

On Question, Amendment agreed to.

LORD ORANMORE AND BROWNE

The next is a consequential Amendment.

Amendment moved— Clause 1, page 1, line 14, at end insert ("judge")—(Lord Oranmore and Browne.)

On Question, Amendment agreed to.

LORD ORANMORE AND BROWNE moved to leave out from subsection (4) the words "on any such application," and to insert "under this Act or under any of the enactments relative to compensation for criminal injuries." The noble Lord said: This Amendment is of a more far-reaching nature. Its object is to protect the property of those who are injured in Ireland as well as their persons. This special Act applies only to injury to the person, and as the law stands at present if any injury is done to property it is at least two years before the compensation allotted to the victim can be recovered. A judge gives a decree that the county council is to levy it. The county council does not levy a rate probably until the following year, and it is levied in two moieties, with the result that the unfortunate person who has suffered does not get compensation for two years. This is an important matter in the case of poor people who may have hayricks or houses destroyed, and it also especially applies to those whom this Bill is designed to protect—the policemen, who may have a small plot of land where the potatoes may be destroyed, or the hay burnt.

Amendment moved— Clause 1, page 2, lines 27 and 28, leave out ("on any such application") and insert ("under this Act or under any of the enactments relative to compensation for criminal injuries").—(Lord Oranmore and Browne.)

THE LORD CHANCELLOR

I think my noble friend is to be congratulated on having made a valuable suggestion, and one which had not occurred to the experienced persons who considered this matter in the Irish Office It is quite true that in many cases where these outrages have taken place great injuries have been maliciously done to the property of the persons who have been violently assaulted, and the present process for obtaining pecuniary reparation is both slow and not specially convenient. I think it is an excellent suggestion that we should make the expeditious remedies, which are so marked a feature of the present Bill, applicable equally to this class of claim.

On Question, Amendment agreed to.

LORD ORANMORE AND BROWNE moved, at the end of subsection (7), to add the words "and the expression police constable' includes any member of the Royal Irish Constabulary or Dublin Metropolitan Police." The noble Lord said: The object of this Amendment is to make the clause clearer. It seems almost unnecessary, but I am informed that there are many head constables and sergeants in the Royal Irish Constabulary who imagine that as they have been promoted from the rank of constable the clause does not apply to them. I understand that His Majesty's Government have no objection to accepting the words I suggest.

Amendment moved— Clause 1, page 3, line 3, at end insert ("and the expression police constable' includes any member of the Royal Irish Constabulary or Dublin Metropolitan Police").—(Lord Orenmore and Browne.)

THE LORD CHANCELLOR

I have no doubt that the Bill as drafted covers this case. But if my noble friend's Amendment will alleviate any anxiety on the part of any person, by all means let it be inserted.

On Question, Amendment agreed to.

Clause 1, as amended, agreed to.

Remaining clauses agreed to.

THE LORD CHANCELLOR

My Lords, I beg to move that Standing Order No. XXXIX be considered in order to its being dispensed with.

Moved accordingly.

THE MARQUESS OF SALISBURY

We have no objection to this Motion, which is moved in pursuance of an arrangement made on the Second Reading. I feel very glad that we are able to help the noble and learned Lord on the Woolsack in the passage of this Bill, and thank him for the conciliatory manner in which he has met the Amendments of my noble friend on the cross-benches.

On Question, Motion agreed to.

Amendments reported.

THE LORD CHANCELLOR

I beg to move that this Bill be now read a third time.

Moved, That the Bill be now read 3a.—(The Lord Chancellor.)

On Question, Bill read 3a, and passed, and returned to the Commons.