HL Deb 12 November 1918 vol 31 cc1231-4

Report of Amendments received (according to Order).

rich man can do what a poor man is unable to do, that is wrong, and it ought to be set right. On the other hand, if it is a question of costs, that also must be dealt with. A poor man must not be sent to an inferior court. Those are the points which I am anxious to make clear, and having said that I offer a most unhesitating opposition to the Bill now proposed. I have only touched upon it to-night, and have not attempted to argue upon the principle of the measure, because I feel that it is impossible to do so at length, and it would not be conducive to the amenities of your Lordships' House that we should discuss at length a Bill which affects the traditions, usages and sanctities of more than a thousand years of English life.

On Question, whether the word "now" shall stand part of the Motion?—

Their Lordships divided:—Contents, 29; Not-Contents, 39.

Crewe, M. Aberconway, L. Ranksborough, L.
Lincolnshire, M. Armaghdale, L. Rathereedan, L.
Chesterfield, E. Buckmaster, L. [Teller.] Roe, L.
Russell, E. Cawley, L. Rotherham, L.
Colebrooke, L. Somerleyton, L.
Sandhurst, V. (L. Chamberlain.) Denman, L. Sudeley, L.
Churchill, V. Fairfax of Cameron, L. Sydenham, L. [Teller.]
Cowdray, V. Islington, L. Weardale, L.
Haldane, V. Montagu of Beaulieu, L. Wittenham, L.
St. Davids, V. Muir Mackenzie, L. Wolverton, L.
Canterbury, L. Abp. Jersey, E. Beresford of Metemmeh, L.
Finlay, L. (L. Chancellor.) Lindsay, E. Braye, L.
York, L. Abp. Sandwich, E. Brodrick, L. (V. Midleton.)
Wigan, L. (E. Crawford.) (L. Privy Seal.) Selborne, E. Channing of Wellingborough, L.
Chaplin, V. Clinton, L.
Argyll, D. Knollys, V. Desart, L. (E. Desart.) [Teller.]
Newcastle, D. Dinevor, L.
Northumberland, D. Bangor, L. Bp. Glanely, L.
Ely, L. Bp. Gorell, L.
Salisbury, M. Norwich, L. Bp. Harris, L.
Rochester, L. Bp. Parmoor, L. [Teller.]
Beauchamp, E. St. David's, L. Bp. Phillimore, L.
Fortescue, E. St. Levan, L.
Grey, E. Annesley, L. Stuart of Wortley, L.
Halsbury, E. Balfour, L.

Clause 15: (14) If a young person over the age of sixteen or the parent of a young person under the age of sixteen represents in writing to the local education authority that he objects to any part of the instruction given in the continuation classes which the young person is required to attend, on the ground that it is contrary or offensive to his religious belief, the obligation under this Act to attend those classes for the purpose of such instruction shall not apply to him, and the local education authority shall, if practicable, arrange for him to receive other instruction in lieu thereof or attend other classes.


I am requested by Lord Bryce to move the Amendment which stands in his name [to omit from subsection (14) of Clause 15 the words "or offensive"], though your Lordships will see one in my name in similar terms, but I understand that those who are promoting the Bill prefer the words suggested by Lord Bryce. In these circumstances I am prepared to move it instead of my Amendment.

Amendment moved— Page 16, line 25, leave out ("or offensive.").—(Lord Balfour of Burleigh.)

On Question, Amendment agreed to.

Amendment moved— Page 16, line 25, after ("belief") insert ("or likely to give offence to his religious feelings").—(Lord Balfour of Burleigh.)

On Question, Amendment agreed to.

Fifth Schedule: 6. The Department may by order at any time after the passing of this Act make such further adaptations in the provisions of any Act (including any local Act and any provisional order duly confirmed) as may seem to them necessary to make those provisions conform with the provisions of this Act, and any order so made shall operate as if enacted in this Act.


My Lords, I do not move my Amendment to leave out paragraph 6 of the Fifth Schedule.


Your Lordships will recollect that this paragraph refers to Orders to be made for the purpose of bringing Acts of Parliament relating to particular schools into harmony with the provisions of the Education Act. Objection was taken on the ground that it was rather a large power. The noble Lord who had an Amendment down to leave out the paragraph has intimated that he does not propose to move it, but I am sensible that it might seem to be a large power and that some check might be desirable. Accordingly, I propose to move to leave out all words after the word, "Act" where it fourthly occurs, for the purpose of inserting the words, "Any Order so made by a Department shall be laid before each House of Parliament forthwith; and unless an Address is presented to His Majesty by either House of Parliament within the next subsequent twenty-one days on which that House has sat next after the Order is laid before it, praying that the Order may be annulled, the Order shall have effect as if enacted in this Act." The object of this is to prevent any abuse of the power. In the Amendment which is on the Paper the words occur "unless and until an Address is presented." The words of the Amendment are taken from a similar provision in the Representation of the People Act. The words "and until" were put in there because it was dealing with a number of administrative Orders and it was desirable that the Order should have effect before the Address had been presented. But here we are dealing with the amendment of schemes in order to adapt them to the Education Act. In these circumstances I think the words "and until" are not apt here, and I move the Amendment leaving out the words "and until."

Amendment moved— Page 37, line 5, leave out from ("Act") to the end of line 6, and insert ("Any order so made by the Department shall be laid before each House of Parliament forthwith; and unless an address is presented to His Majesty by either House of Parliament within the next subsequent twenty-one days on which that House has sat next after the order is laid before it, praying that the order may be annulled, the order shall have effect as if enacted in this Act").—(The Lord Chancellor.)

On Question, Amendment agreed to.


My Lords having regard to the advanced period of the session and the great desirability of not incurring any risk of the Bill not passing into law, I ask your Lordships to allow the Third Reading to be taken this evening. My noble friends are interested in the Bill, and I hope there will be no objection to that course. I beg to move.

Moved, That the Bill be now read 3a.—(The Lord Chancellor.)

On Question, Bill read 3a., and passed, and returned to the Commons.