PRISONERS OF WAR. (Hansard, 24 April 1918)

§ THE ASSISTANT UNDER SECRETARY OF STATE FOR FOREIGN AFFAIRS (LORD NEWTON)
My Lords, as my noble friend and the House have no doubt observed, the Agreement of which he speaks has, I am happy to say, just been ratified.

§ THE EARL OF SELBORNE
Hear, hear.

§ LORD NEWTON
And, as my noble friend was good enough to make some complimentary observations with regard to my individual services, I should like to say that I am already sufficiently accustomed to public life not to expect any gratitude from any particular quarter; but at the same time I do not think that there has ever been so much unjust abuse lavished upon myself and the other persons concerned as has been the case over this question of prisoners in Turkey. I do not think that the ordinary person realises in the least that the difficulties attending prisoner questions in Turkey are infinitely greater than those which surround similar questions in Germany. In the first place, the Turks, like the Germans, had no desire to exchange any prisoners at all. They were in all probability extremely proud of being in a position to hold European captives. These prisoners were in addition to that, probably a source of profit to them; and as regards their own people, whom we held in very much greater numbers, they were indifferent as regards their condition, knowing, of course, that they were well treated. There was, in fact, only one individual in whom they have ever shown the slightest interest. As a matter of fact, the battle—if I may so call it—regarding the exchanges has been largely fought round this one personage; and the noble Earl will not be surprised to learn that as this individual was the only valuable asset we possessed we were not likely to let him go without a thoroughly satisfactory equivalent.
Now, as regards the fruitless efforts which His Majesty's Government continually made to secure the exchange of these prisoners and the amelioration of their surroundings, I may say without exaggeration that I think we corresponded with the Turkish Government for something like a year with no effect being produced. Then I persuaded the War Cabinet to allow me to enter into direct communication with the Turkish delegates in Switzerland. It took the Turks five months to assent to a 851 meeting, and when I eventually proceeded to Berne I spent five weeks arguing and haggling with these representatives before we were able to arrive at an Agreement. An Agreement having been arrived at and I having been personally assured by these representatives that ratification would be only a question of a few hours, no less than four months have elapsed since that took place. This will give the House some indication of the laboriousness of effecting any satisfactory arrangement with these people.
I do not wish to impute any particular blame to the Turkish delegates whom I met with regard to this excessive delay. I honestly think that they were well disposed, and that, so far as it lay within their power, they were anxious to improve the circumstances of their captives. But I feel bound to add that they were not particularly well equipped for their task; because unfortunately their information regarding the question was of a very rudimentary and imperfect character. For instance, I was never able to obtain from these gentlemen any precise figures as to the number of captives they held. Whenever I asked how many British prisoners there were in their hands, they would reply that they thought there were about 10,000. It really would not have surprised me in the least if they had answered, with Oriental imagery, that the captives were as numerous as the sands on the seashore, or the leaves of the forest. It was evident that they were completely ignorant as to the real figures. Our own calculation is that there are something like 8,000 prisoners in Turkey altogether. Then they suffered from the disability of being without instructions; they were in the habit of mislaying or losing important documents which were submitted to them; and when we complained of irregularities—for instance, with regard to the delivery of parcels or with regard to correspondence—their reply was, "Oh, we are very sorry, but we are in just as had a case ourselves; our correspondence is equally deficient; unfortunately that is one of the things which we must all be expected to bear."
As an example of their ingenuousness, I cannot help drawing attention to one particular circumstance. The noble Earl will observe when he reads the text of the Agreement that there is a paragraph expressing the hope that the British prisoner camps in future will be surrounded by plain wire instead of barbed wire. As people who are acquainted with prisoner 852 questions are aware, a new disease has been invented known as "barbed wire disease." It is, of course, only a paraphrase for nervous breakdown; but these Turkish gentlemen were evidently under the impression that "barbed wire disease" was communicated by the points of the barbed wire, possibly by the prisoners rubbing themselves against them and so contracting the malady. Therefore they ask that special provision shall be made under which in future prisoners should be retained within plain instead of barbed wire. I presume that this is not the first occasion upon which an unconscious joke has appeared in an international document. At all events, I did not think it worth while to make any alteration with regard to this particular matter.
To turn now to the Agreement itself. In view of the alarming reports which had reached this country from time to time respecting the condition of our men—a condition which I am inclined to think was due not so much to systematic cruelty as to incapacity, to carelessness, and to the economic condition of the country—in view of this it was obviously desirable to aim at two main objects, namely, the exchange of as many prisoners as possible and the securing of inspection of camps by the protecting Legation, the Dutch Legation. With regard to exchanges, as my noble friend is aware, His Majesty's Government do not countenance the exchange of able-bodied combatants; and, as he is also aware, the system by which invalids are selected for exchange necessitates visits by Dutch Commissions and by Swiss Commissions, and is altogether a very laborious and complicated procedure. It appeared to me that in dealing with Orientals it would be much more tactful to adopt a more rapid and simple system. Therefore with the consent of my military colleague I proposed and arranged with the Turks that this examination, instead of being conducted by an elaborate Commission of neutrals, should be carried out in the following way—namely, that one British doctor should be left per thousand prisoners, and that he, in conjunction with a couple of Turkish doctors, should select the individuals who appeared eligible for exchange, under, of course, reciprocal conditions as regards prisoners in our possession.
It was also agreed that this selection should be made irrespective of rank and 853 date of capture, and should be dependent solely upon the physical condition of the officer or man. In order to accelerate matters pending examination, it was further agreed that there should be an immediate selection made of 1,000 British prisoners on one side and 1,500 Turkish prisoners on the other, who should be exchanged as soon as the ship could be provided and necessary measures taken for securing the safety of the ship. The port of Scala Nuova, in the South of Smyrna, was selected as the port of debarkation in Turkey. The steamer will proceed from Egypt, and on her return voyage will disembark at Taranto such British prisoners as are entitled to be returned to this country. As regards civilians, it has been arranged that all civilians who wish to be repatriated, under military age and above military age, shall be repatriated, and that as regards those above military age they shall be exchanged on a head for head basis. With regard to inspections, as the House is no doubt aware, inspections were obstinately refused until this meeting took place. I am happy to say that this concession has at last been obtained, and it has been arranged that the Dutch Legation shall be authorised to visit all camps in Asiatic Turkey outside the military district of the Taurus, and the Turkish Government undertake to bring back men within the Taurus region to the regions which are liable to inspection as soon as the necessary arrangements can be made.
The other provisions, which are of less importance, relate to the formation of Help Committees in the camps, improved medical treatment, facilities for the purchase of food and clothing and the transmission of supplies, and Agreements have been arrived at with regard to punishments, reprisals, trials, and matters of that kind on the lines of the Agreement come to at The Hague with the German Government. The censorship of parcels and matters of that kind is to be relaxed, correspondence is to be accelerated, and the vessels which will transport the exchanged prisoners are to be permitted to carry supplies both of food and clothing which will be distributed by the Dutch Legation.
These are the main provisions of the Agreement, and as the War Office have now sanctioned largely increased allowances to British prisoners in Turkey, it may be hoped that the lot of these men will now 854 be considerably more tolerable. I am not by any means an optimist by nature, and I do not wish to encourage any undue hopes. It is unfortunately the case that there is bound to be considerable delay in view of what has already happened. At the same time, without being an optimist, I do feel that the ratification of this Agreement, although arrived at very late in the day, is in itself a hopeful sign. I also flatter myself that I was able to convince the Turkish delegates that the carrying out of the Agreement was just as much, if not more, in their interest as it is in our own.
I only desire to say this in conclusion. Whereas there were a large number of people in this country who vehemently denounced any suggestion of meeting either German or Turkish delegates and who predicted that nothing would ever result from such a meeting, and that even if Agreements were arrived at they would never be carried out by the German Government, I desire to point out that these people have shown themselves to be completely in error. The Agreement made with the Germans by direct communication with German delegates at The Hague has at all events resulted in this, that there are thousands of Englishmen walking about free at the present moment who, if that meeting had not taken place, would still be prisoners in Germany. That is a fact which nobody can get over; and again I repeat that, while not an optimist, I do not see any reason why eventually the same process should not take place with regard to such of our men as have been unfortunate enough to be prisoners of the Turks during the last two years.

§ THE MARQUESS OF SALISBURY
My Lords, I think I shall be only expressing the view of your Lordships when I congratulate the Government, and my noble friend in particular, upon the statement which he has been able to make. We have watched with the greatest sympathy and interest the efforts which my noble friend has made over all these months to help these unfortunate prisoners both in Germany and in Turkey, and it is clear that his persistence and industry—and, may I say, his diplomatic tact?—have been crowned with very conspicuous success. I congratulate him, and thank him warmly for the observations he has been able to make.