§ VISCOUNT MIDLETONMy Lords, I rise to ask the noble Lord who represents the War Office whether it is intended to make any increase to the pay of medical officers of the Territorial Force who have been obliged to give up their home practice on volunteering for foreign service. I should not have troubled your Lordships with this question, but that I have on two occasions in the course of debate requested the attention of the War Office and the India Office to it. I would only now say that, as I understand the matter, the Territorial medical officers who were in the Territorial Force before the war and who volunteered for foreign service when war broke out are at this moment receiving less pay than medical officers who have been engaged since the outbreak of war and who are serving side by side with them, in some cases in the same battalions. These medical officers, as I understand, have 14s. a day and allowances in the first instance, and 24s. a day in the other, the difference between them being some shillings a day. In addition, the medical officers who were in the Territorial Force before the commencement of the war had to find their own uniforms, whilst those engaged since have been given an allowance for uniform by the State. I believe that on all hands the hardships of these officers is admitted. Many of them have given up practices of £1,000 a year or more, and are paying more than they receive from the Army for substitutes to carry on their practices in their absence. Many of them are now in India, and I think it is a great hardship that they should be called upon to serve at a lower rate of pay side by side with men who did not undertake the liability until later. I have reason to believe that the War Office look very favourably upon the claims of these officers, and I hope that it will be in the power of the noble Lord to give me a favourable reply.
§ LORD NEWTONMy Lords, I think the noble Viscount would be the first to recognise that medical officers do net stand in a different category from other persons. It would be easy to show that many officers in tile Territorial Force had abandoned even more lucrative positions than the medical profession in order to give their services to the country. Therefore I confess that the suggestion that an exception should be made in the case of 561 medical officers does not appear to me to be very strong. The main cause of complaint, I gather, of these medical officers is that the pay of the lower ranks is inadequate, and that Special Reserve and Territorial Force officers were not allowed to count unmobilised service towards the increase of pay given to Regular officers of the Royal Army Medical Corps. I understand that it has not been found possible to allow unmobilised service to count, because any proposal which involved reckoning time spent partly in civil employment is calculated to give cause of complaint to the Regular soldier whose whole time has had to be devoted to service with the Colours. In view of the admitted grievance of the junior officers, it has been decided to promote to the rank of captain all lieutenants in the R.A.M.C. and the Territorial Force who have given six months' mobilised service. Steps to give effect to this decision will be taken immediately, and this will date as from April 1 last. I believe I may add that the further consideration of this question is not entirely precluded.
§ THE DUKE OF RUTLANDMy Lords, I do not wish to detain your Lordships for more than a moment, but the reply of my noble friend opposite has a little bit bewildered me. There has been rather a tangle of words, and the question of unmobilised service is a very difficult one to deal with. I am sure that Territorial medical officers would be grateful for anything that could be done to put them on as satisfactory a footing as their brethren serving in the other branches of His Majesty's Army. I know there has been a considerable amount of dissatisfaction amongst the ranks of the junior officers in the Territorial medical service, and I think it is a dissatisfaction which they were well entitled to feel.
I am not going into the point raised by Lord Midleton as to these men having given up their civil practices, and so on. It is perfectly true, what he said about it. But they feel that, whatever may have been their condition in the past, it is highly desirable that their service conditions and pay in the present should be commensurate with, and exactly the smile as, those of their brethren serving in other branches of the medical service in His Majesty's Army. Even with the allowances which they get at this moment 562 plus the 14s. a day as against the 24s. a day which their brethren in the R.A.M.C. and others serving with the Regular battalions now receive, their pay does not come within something like 2s. 6d. a day of the amount received by the medical officers serving in the other branches, and 2s. 6d. a day works out at a considerable sum per annum—at least a considerable sum for those gentlemen who have given up good positions in coming forward to serve their country in time of need.
I would add that I do not think any more admirable body of men could possibly be found than the officers the Territorial medical service. I have seen a great deal of their work, and been cognisant of what they have done all through the war; and I earnestly hope that the word "economy" will be forgotten in this instance by His Majesty's Treasury. I am certain that no more unwise and unjust thing could be done by the Government and by the Treasury than to refrain from putting on an exact equality the medical officers now serving with the Territorial Force and those serving in the other branches of His Majesty's Forces. It is extremely difficult in existing financial circumstances to get the necessary medical officers for some of the second and third lines of the Territorial Force. Therefore I trust that no question of undue economy will be employed in this case, and that the Government will see their way to meet what I conceive to be the just claims of the Territorial medical officers of His Majesty's Forcer.
LORD HARRISMy Lords, it seemed to me that the reply of Lord Newton did nut appear to be an answer to the Question put by my noble friend on the Front Opposition Bench. I understood my noble friend's inquiry to relate to the medical officer who was in the Territorial Army before mobilisation, who I understand is being paid worse thin the Territorial medical officer who joined since mobilisation. I do not know how much the difference is, but I can calculate on the figures quoted by Lord Midleton, and I should think he is pretty nearly £1 a week worse off than the new Territorial medical officer; and then I doubt whether there has been included the bonus which the new Territorial medical officer is going to get at the end of his service, which has not been promised to the old Territorial medical officer. I may be wrong, but it seemed to 563 me that the noble Lord's reply did not deal with the particular case which the noble Viscount quoted. I must say I hope that the case brought up is being supported by the War Office in its communications with the Treasury.
§ LORD NEWTONAs I have already stated, negotiations are still proceeding with the Treasury on the subject.
LORD HARRISOn the subject of the difference between the pay of the old Territorial medical officer and the new?
§ LORD NEWTONOn the whole thing.
LORD HARRISExcuse me, but I want a specific answer to that particular question. Is it the case that the pay of the old Territorial medical officer as compared with that of the new is being taken up by the War Office?
§ LORD NEWTONYes, so I understand.