Lords Sitting of 9 September 1914

Preamble
The Earl of MINTO—Sat first in Parliament after the death of his father.

THE WAR—INDIA'S SUPPORT.
*THE LORD PRIVY SEAL AND SECRETARY OF STATE FOR INDIA (THE MARQUESS OF CREWE): My Lords, I think it will be of interest to the House if I state what has happened in reference to the wonderful series of offers of assistance and support which have been received from the Indian Empire, and the response which has been made to those offers. In the first instance—although it is, of course, not the first in order of date—I will read to the House a Message which His Majesty has sent to the Princes and peoples of India. The King-Emperor's Message is as follows—
"To THE PRINCES AND PEOPLES OF MY INDIAN EMPIRE:
"During the past few weeks the peoples of My whole Empire at Home and Overseas have moved with one mind and purpose to confront and overthrow an unparalleled assault upon the continuity of civilisation and the peace of mankind.
"The calamitous conflict is not of My seeking. My voice has been cast throughout on the side of peace. My Ministers earnestly strove to allay the causes of strife and to appease differences with which My Empire was not concerned. Had I stood aside when in defiance of pledges to which My Kingdom was a party the soil of Belgium was violated, and her cities laid desolate, when the very life of the French nation was threatened with extinction, I should have sacrificed My honour and given to destruction the liberties of My Empire and of mankind. I rejoice that every part of the Empire is with me in this decision.
"Paramount regard for treaty faith and the pledged word of rulers and peoples is the common heritage of England and of India.
"Among the many incidents that have marked the unanimous uprising of the populations of My Empire in defence of its unity and integrity, nothing has moved me more than the passionate devotion to My Throne
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expressed both by My Indian subjects and by the Feudatory Princes and the Ruling Chiefs of India, and their prodigal offers of their lives and their resources in the cause of the Realm. Their one-voiced demand to be foremost in the conflict has touched My heart, and has inspired to the highest issues the love and devotion which, as I well know, have ever linked My Indian subjects and myself. I recall to mind India's gracious message to the British nation of goodwill and fellowship, which greeted My return in February 1912 after the solemn ceremony of My Coronation Durbar at Delhi, and I find in this hour of trial a full harvest and a noble fulfilment of the assurance given by you that the destinies of Great Britain and India are indissolubly linked."
I received yesterday a summary of offers of service and money made in India to the Viceroy, of which I think it will be interesting if I convey the general gist to your Lordships. The rulers of the Indian Native States, numbering nearly 700 altogether, have with one accord rallied to the defence of the Empire and offered their personal services and the resources of their States. From among the many Princes and nobles who volunteered for service in the war the Viceroy has chosen the Chiefs of Jodhpur, Bikaner, Kishangarh, Rutlam, Sachin, and Patiala, Sir Pertab Singh (Regent of Jodhpur), the Heir Apparent of Bhopal, and a brother of the Maharaja of Cooch Behar, together with other Princes belonging to noble families. It will, I know, be of interest to your Lordships' House, where he has so many personal friends, to know that the veteran Sir Pertab Singh, in spite of his seventy years, refused to be denied the right of serving the King-Emperor in person and is himself going to the front, accompanied by his great-nephew the reigning Maharaja, who is only sixteen years of age and who was brought up at Wellington College and has also, perhaps, become known to some of your Lordships. These have already joined the Expeditionary Force. There are some other Princes, the Chiefs of Jaora and Dholpur, and the Maharaja of Gwalior—also known to many of your Lordships—who, together with the Heir Apparent of Palampur, were, to their great regret, prevented from quitting their States.
There are twenty-seven States in India that maintain Imperial Service Troops,

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and immediately on the outbreak of war the services of all of those corps were placed at the disposal of the Viceroy. From twelve of those States the Viceroy has accepted contingents of Infantry, Cavalry, Sappers, and transport, and also the Bikaner Camel Corps; and some of those have already embarked on active service. Further than that, a number of Chiefs, entirely of their own volition, combined to provide a hospital ship, to be named "The Loyalty," for the use of the Expeditionary Force. I think I mentioned to the House before that the Maharaja of Mysore had placed a sum of Rs. 50 lakhs at the disposal of the Government for expenditure in connection with the Expeditionary Force. The Viceroy adds that the Maharaja of Gwalior, besides sharing in the expenses of the hospital ship—the idea of which was started by himself and that eminent lady the Begun of Bhopal—has placed large sums of money at the disposal of the Government of India for the purpose of providing a great number of horses as remounts. From Mahomedan Loharu in the Punjab and from two States in Baluchistan there are offers of camels with drivers to be supplied and maintained by the Chiefs and the Sardars of those States. The Maharaja of Rewa, a distinguished Chief in Central India, has offered his troops, his treasury, and even his private jewellery to be placed at the disposal of His Majesty the King-Emperor. I ought to add that a number of Chiefs, the Maharaja of Kashmir, the Maharaja of Bundi, besides the Maharaja of Gwalior, the Maharaja of Indore, and the Maharaja of Orchha have besides independently subscribed large sums to the Fund of His Royal Highness the Prince of Wales. The Maharaja of Kashmir gave a large subscription to the Indian Fund, and, what will seem to your Lordships rather a new departure in the case of an Indian Prince, presided at a meeting of 20,000 people held at Srinagar and himself delivered a stirring speech, as the result of which large subscriptions were collected. The Maharaja Holkar offers, free of charge, all the horses belonging to his State forces which the Government may find it convenient to accept. The Nizam of Hyderabad has made a similar offer, as also have the Jam of Jamnagar and some of the other Bombay Chiefs. The Viceroy adds that every Chief in the Bombay Presidency has placed the whole of the resources of his State at the disposal of Government.
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Then we go further afield. The Mehtar of Chitral—a name which evokes memories of quite a different kind—and the various tribes in the Khyber Agency have sent loyal messages and offers of support to His Excellency's Government. All States, however remote, and some of the quite small States, have expressed their desire to give such assistance as they can. The Viceroy goes on to say, very truly, that last but not least, outside India altogether, generous offers of assistance were received from the Nepal Durbar. The Nepal Government have placed the whole of their military resources at the disposal of the British Government, and the Prime Minister, who is known also I am sure to some of your Lordships because he has been here, offered a sum of Rs. 3 lakhs to the Viceroy for the purchase of machine guns for the equipment of some of the British Gurkha regiments, and also gave large donations from his private purse to the Indian Relief Fund and to the Prince of Wales's Fund. He also offered Rs. 3,000 for the purchase of machine guns for the 4th Gurkha Rifles.
Then we go still further on to the Heights. We find that the Dalai Lama has offered 1,000 Tibetan troops for service under the British Government. He also states that innumerable Lamas all over Tibet are offering up prayers for the success of British arms. In fact, there is only one spirit and one movement over the whole of India. The Viceroy has received thousands of telegrams and letters from every quarter expressing loyalty and the desire to assist; and the local administrations have also received a vast number. They have come from every community, from all manner of different associations, religious and political, from all the different creeds, and from countless numbers of individuals offering their resources or their personal services. The Viceroy mentions in his telegram sonic typical examples: the All India Moslem League and a number of other Moslem associations in Bengal and Rangoon; the Trustees of the Aligarh. College; others from Behar and Calcutta; another from the Khoja community, who are followers of a gentleman also well known to your Lordships, the Aga Khan; the Punjab Moslem League, the Behar Landholders' Association, the Taluqdars of Oudh, the Association of the Punjab Chiefs; the Provincial Congresses of Madras and of the United Provinces, which are branches of the India Congress,

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which is well known by name at any rate to most of your Lordships; and the Punjab Association representing the orthodox Sikhs, and the Parsee community of Bombay.
There has also been a number of enthusiastic offers of medical help, of some of which I hope we shall be able gratefully to avail ourselves. The Zemindars of Madras offered 500 horses at quite an early stage in the proceedings; and the Imperial Indian Relief Fund, which was started, of course quite independently of any fund here, for the relief of distress caused in India itself, has been responded to with great enthusiasm and vigour. There were a certain number of Indian Chiefs in Europe at the time. These have not been any more backward in offering their assistance and help. I find that of those who were in these parts the Maharaja and the Maharani Maji Sahiba of Bharatpur subscribed to the Indian Relief Fund and offered the whole resources of their State to Government. The Raja of Akalkot, a Bombay Chief, offered his personal service; and the Raja of Pudukota placed his entire resources at the disposal of Government. The Gaekwar of Baroda placed at our disposal the whole of his troops and the resources of his State. The son of the Mir of Khairpur, a Mahomedan magnate in North-West India, offered his personal service. And I find also that of the British Indian residents in this country a great number, young and old, have shown their one desire to offer some form of assistance—personal service, or medical service, or some form of contribution to the Empire—in a most loyal and generous manner.
This afternoon I received a telegram from the Viceroy describing what happened yesterday at the meeting of his Legislative Council at Simla. The Viceroy tells me that, in opening the proceedings, the members stood while he conveyed to them the Message from the King—the Message which I read to the House at the commencement of my remarks. The Viceroy made a speech, in which he said that he was sure he was expressing the views of the Council and of the whole of India in assuring His Majesty of unflinching loyalty and devotion. He went on to dwell upon the causes which led up to the war and the wicked and wanton manner in which it had been thrust upon the British Empire, and he explained the wholehearted efforts which had been made by
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Sir Edward Grey for the preservation of peace so long as such preservation was possible. He expressed, of course on his own account also, the warmest gratitude for the attitude of the people of India which has been described in what I have just stated to your Lordships. Then when the Viceroy had concluded, Mr. Chitnavis, representing the Indian community, expressed the gratefulness which they all felt for His Majesty's Message, and asked the Viceroy to assure His Majesty that the whole country was with him in this hour of crisis and would loyally and devotedly do everything possible to ensure the success of the British arms. He then moved the following Resolution—
"That in view of the great war involving most momentous issues now in progress in Europe into which our August Sovereign has been forced to enter by obligations of honour and duty to preserve the neutrality guaranteed by treaty and the liberties of a friendly State, the members of this Council, as voicing the feeling that animates the whole of the people of India, desire to give expression to their feelings of unswerving loyalty and enthusiastic devotion to their King Emperor and an assurance of their unflinching support to the British Government. They desire at the same time to express the opinion that the people of India, in addition to the military assistance now being afforded by India to the Empire, would wish to share in the heavy financial burden now imposed by the war on the United Kingdom, and request the Government of India to take this view into consideration and thus to demonstrate the unity of India with the Empire. They request His Excellency the President to be so good as to convey the substance of this Resolution to His Majesty the King-Emperor and His Majesty's Government."
That was seconded by one of the principal Mahomedan leaders, the Raja of Mahmudabad, who made an important speech. It was supported by one of the Punjab Sardars, and was further supported in an eloquent speech—the Viceroy states—by Mr. Malabiya, one of the leading representatives of Indian opinion. It was also supported by a distinguished Parsee gentleman, Sir F. Azullbhoy Currimbhoy, who speaks for Bombay; by Mr. Ghuznavi, speaking for the Mahomedans of Eastern Bengal, and by Mr. Banerjee, who is well known as an exponent of liberal views in Bengal. Mr. Banerjee, in supporting the Resolution, pointed out that—
"It was the duty of the Council to focus the sentiments of support and enthusiastic loyalty by which every province of the Empire was animated. They desired to tell the world, the enemies of England and all else whom it might concern, that their loyalty was not lip-deep, but that behind the serried ranks of one of the finest armies of the world were the vast and multitudinous races and peoples of India bound together as one man."

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The Viceroy replied, and the Resolution was carried without a single dissentient.
I think, my Lords, that we must all agree that this demonstration of true and heartfelt loyalty in India to the King-Emperor and to the Government is one of the most gratifying facts as the outcome of the present war. As we all know, the devotion and the offers of support from the self-governing Dominions of the Crown have been not less striking. Those Governments are manned by people of our own blood, with countless memories and traditions which centre round these islands. But it is, perhaps, even more striking, certainly not less gratifying, that those who speak for the various races in India—races which represent a civilisation of almost untold antiquity; races which have been remarkable in arms, in arts, and in the science of government—should in so whole-hearted a manner rally round the British Government, and, most of all, round the person of their Emperor at such a moment as this; and I am certain that this House will desire to express, through those of us who are entitled to speak for it, its appreciation of their attitude and our recognition of the part that they have played and are playing.
*THE MARQUESS OF LANSDOWNE: My Lords, we have listened to an announcement from the noble Marquess which seemed to us to be one of surpassing interest—an announcement which I venture to say will prove to be of historic importance in the annals of the British Empire. And let me, before I go further, express the admiration with which we listened to the words in which His Majesty the King was pleased to acknowledge the offers which his Government had received from the peoples and Princes of India. I do not think it would have been possible to express in simpler, more dignified, or more appropriate language the feelings which animate us at this moment and which lead us to embark in this great struggle with absolute confidence in the justice of our cause. The noble Marquess spoke of the "wonderful series of offers" which have been received from the peoples of India. It is indeed a wonderful series of offers, and they were doubly appreciated by those of us who have been concerned with Indian affairs as we listened to the noble Marquess while he travelled over, not only the Indian Empire in the more restricted sense of the
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term, but the confines of the States which adjoin it, and described to us how one and all of them had come forward at this critical moment to assure us of their support in whatever form they were able to provide it.
Quoting from a speech in support of the Resolution passed in the Legislative Council the other day, the noble Marquess spoke of the "multitudinous races and peoples" of India. It is indeed a great thing that those multitudinous races and peoples should have joined in this movement without reference to geographical limits, to religious distinctions, to political divisions, or to differences of race. We know how deep those cleavages are, and how often it is that they separate one part of India acutely from another. But in this case they were not allowed to prevail, and I am sure that the result will produce an immense impression not only upon the people of this country but upon all who, no matter in what part of the world, are anxious spectators of the great struggle which is now proceeding.
The noble Marquess will not think it unnatural on my part if I say that I listened with special interest to that part of his speech in which he gave us an account of the manner in which the ruling Chiefs of India have come forward at this moment. There was a time when I had the honour of enjoying the friendship mid intimacy of a number of those Chiefs; and I left India deeply convinced of the sincerity of their desire to bear, whenever the opportunity was offered to them, a useful and honourable part in the affairs of the Empire. Their generosity is proverbial. The word "generosity" is often coupled with the word "princely," and in India, as the noble Marquess knows, we have every reason to be aware of what "princely generosity" means. But in this case, great as that generosity has been, they have given us a great deal more. I well remember the pride which these great Chiefs and rulers took in the Imperial Service Corps instituted in the time of my predecessor, Lord Dufferin; and I know that it was their ambition that those Imperial Service troops should not merely be, as they were, extraordinarily efficient and smart on parade, but that they should be given a chance of fighting alongside of our troops in the cause of the Empire. I heard with great interest the noble Marquess's catalogue of the Princes who are

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to accompany the Indian Force on this campaign—with some of them I have the honour to be acquainted, others are the sons of fathers who were well known to me—and I may perhaps be permitted to echo what he said with regard to one whom I am able to describe as an old personal friend of my own. I mean the Regent of Jodhpur, better known to his intimates as Sir Pertab Singh. I also heard with special satisfaction the noble Marquess's account of the support which he was receiving from the Maharaja of Nepal. We owe a great debt to the Nepal Government, for it is with their assistance and concurrence that we are able to raise those magnificent Gurkhas, of whom I am glad to know a certain number will accompany the Indian Expedition.
THE MARQUESS OF CREWE: Seven battalions.
THE MARQUESS OF LANSDOWNE: I am glad to hear that. I doubt, my Lords, whether every one in this country realises how great a thing it is that these ruling Chiefs who have come forward in this way upon our side are doing, or how important a position they occupy in their own country. I wonder, for example, whether every one realises that the Maharaja of Mysore, to whose munificent gift the noble Marquess referred, rules over a population which exceeds in numbers the whole of the population of Sweden. I wonder whether every one calls to mind that the Maharaja of Gwalior has more subjects than the King of Denmark; or that the Nizam of Hyderabad governs a people twice as numerous as the people of the Netherlands and three times as numerous as the people of Ireland. It is no small thing that these rulers, standing where they do in our Indian system, should have come forward without exception and given such practical proof of their desire to help us. I venture on the part of those who sit on this side of the House to congratulate the noble Marquess on the manner in which the India Office has been supported at this critical time, and I add to that our congratulations to the Viceroy to whom, at a moment when he must have many sad preoccupations, the magnificent response of the people of India must bring consolation and encouragement. I am sure it will be the desire of the House, in whatever way may be fitting, that our cordial thanks should be conveyed to the people of India and to the Indian Chiefs who have stood by us in so conspicuous a manner.

THE CIVIL SERVICE AND THE COLOURS.
*LORD REDESDALE: My Lords, I rise to ask His Majesty's Government whether they will be prepared to grant facilities for young Civil Servants to join the Colours provided that they can find suitable substitutes among retired members of the Civil Service, or, I might almost add, other persons who could be accepted. The Secretary of State for War has declared that he requires 500,000 men. Mr. Asquith, in that glorious speech which has been ringing like a clarion call to arms throughout the British Isles and indeed over the seas wherever the English language is spoken, emphasised the same thing; but he went a step further. He told us that he wanted the best men. The day before that great speech was made I ventured to write a letter to The Times, in which I suggested something of the nature of what I have put in my Question on the Paper to-day. That letter has brought me an amount of correspondence which it is far beyond my powers to answer or even to acknowledge, but it shows that there are scores upon scores of young Civil Servants who are burning to join the Colours and who feel acutely the privation, if I may so call it, of being obliged to remain at home.
Unlike those "heroes" who prefer staying at home and playing with balls of various sizes to going where the bullets are flying and the shrapnel and shell are hissing in the air, these Civil Servants are burning to do something for their country in this hour of need. And you can hardly imagine a better class of men from whom to draw recruits such as were asked for by Mr. Asquith. They are many of them University men, some have gained high honours, and all of them have had the highest possible education; they are just the men who would be able to supply what we are told is in these days the greatest necessity in the case of every soldier—the brains behind the rifle. It is quite evident that those who could be drawn upon for active service must of necessity be the younger men. Nobody knows better than I do that you would throw a Department out of gear if you took away from it those men who have to perform the most responsible work. But there are hundreds of young men who have recently joined the Civil Service, whose work is really such as could be taught to an educated man in a very

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short time. And if, in addition to being educated, the men who came forward had been accustomed to business and had been trained in offices, then the senior clerks in the various Departments would be able to make of these volunteers most useful men in a very short time. Those from whom I have had letters expressing a desire to give their services in this way comprise old Civil Servants, old bank managers, solicitors, men of letters, men of business—all of them men whom, I repeat, any senior clerk would be able to train in a week to do all the business that would be required of them.
The men who might join in this way as volunteers, if ever this proposal should come to anything, must, of course, be content to take the humblest duties. They must be content to be the hewers of wood and drawers of water for the Department. They cannot undertake the more responsible work. But I feel that you have in them a reservoir of good material that could be turned to account at very short notice. And by adopting this proposal you would have enabled these young Civil Servants to avoid the stigma, under which they now are, of staying at home and doing nothing, and you would have conferred upon the older men who are willing to come forward and take their places the inestimable boon of feeling that they were doing something for their country when their country was in dire need. The spirit which animates all the men who have written to me is one of the highest patriotism. Indeed, it is something beyond patriotism—it is very reasoned patriotism. They do not believe that if they come forward to help in this matter they will be helping France alone, or Belgium alone, or even England alone; they feel that they will be helping to preserve the liberty, the freedom, and the independence of Europe and of the world at large, and doing their best to avoid the world falling under that militarism to which Prussia and Germany are at this moment slaves. If my proposal comes to anything, no doubt the details will have to be arranged. At present it is a very crude and undigested proposal. But I venture to lay it before His Majesty's Government in all humility, asking them to turn it over in their minds and see whether they cannot do something in this matter to meet the wishes of the younger Civil Servants of the Crown.
*THE MARQUESS OF CREWE: My Lords, I am sure that everybody will sympathise with the spirit which has animated my noble friend in laying this particular proposal before the House. At the same time I think I had better say at once that it does not appear to me possible to lay down any general regulation of the kind which I think the noble Lord desires to see carried into effect. It seems to us that in a matter of this sort each particular case has to be dealt with on its merits by those who are responsible for an particular Department. As a matter of fact the heads of the various Departments, as I am informed—and I can certainly speak with confidence about my own Department—have done what they could to give facilities for joining one branch or other of the military forces to which such men could be posted to those in their Offices who seem particularly fitted for the service. This is altogether apart from the considerable depletion which the noble Lord knows has taken place of the Public Departments, including those who have been attached to some part or other of the Military Service, either the Territorial Force or some other branch, and who have already had military training.
Those to whom the noble Lord refers, I suppose, are Civil Servants who have had no military training, and who at any rate if they were to become officers would have to undergo a very long course of training, in spite of their special capacity and general ability, before they could be fitted to go to the front. And I cannot help thinking that the noble Lord rather overstated the case when he spoke of these men who were left behind in Public Departments as doing nothing. Even at this time it has to be remembered that there are other absolutely necessary forms of public service besides those which involve service in the firing line. We all of us, of course, fix our main interest for the time upon those who are actually engaged in the combatant service, but there is a great deal of national work of a different kind to be done. And I should like to remind my noble friend of this, that a large part of the work which is being thrown upon these Civil Servants—very often extra work involving overtime, which is most cheerfully undertaken by them—is directly concerned with the supply services and with countless incidents arising out of the war, work which, with

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all respect to my noble friend, cannot be done with anything like decent efficiency by people, hank managers or anybody else, however willing, called in from outside without the particular training which comes from experience in the Civil Service.
There are, of course, cases in which, as the noble Lord has pointed out, a young man has just joined the Civil Service, has hardly learned his job at all, and might just as well, perhaps, take to soldiering. In some of those cases I have no doubt that permission has been given to undertake it. I think that if the noble Lord gets the figures he will find that the number of those who have gone from different branches of the Public Service to join one branch or another of the fighting services has been considerable, and it is important to bear that in mind in considering the whole question. In addition to this, a great number of retired members of the Civil Service have voluntarily come to the help of their old Departments, affording the most cheerful service, which they would be quite prepared, if allowed, to give gratuitously, and have done a great deal to fill up the gaps which have been left by those who have gone. I can assure the noble Lord that we have not neglected this side of the question. I do not myself believe that anything like a general depletion of the Civil Service—I mean supposing all the men under thirty-five years of age were enlisted in some force or another, which I suppose is what the noble Lord has in his mind—and the casting of these men en masse into the ranks of the Army would be to the public benefit. And for two reasons. In the first place, those particular men, as I have ventured to point out, are doing more valuable national work in many cases as they are; and, in the second place, there is, happily, no lack of young men coming forward to bring the National Forces up to at any rate a million if that were thought necessary. That being so I confess I cannot hold out any hope to the noble Lord of any general or dramatic movement in the direction which he indicates, although
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I sympathise with his general object and can assure him that so far as individual cases are concerned every possible consideration is given to them.
*THE MARQUESS OF LANSDOWNE: My Lords, I think the reply of the noble Marquess has met my noble friend very fairly. The noble Marquess tells us that the Civil Service has already undergone a considerable amount of depletion owing to the calls made upon members of it who belong to the Territorial Force or to other branches of the Service. But, in addition to that, we gather from the noble Marquess that in special cases and where the Civil Servant can be spared without serious Departmental inconvenience leave has been given by the chief of the Department to the gentleman in question to join the Army. That seems to me as far as the Government can reasonably be expected to go. I must add this one observation, that I hope that those junior members of the Civil Service who cannot be spared, and who are, perhaps, as we have been told, working overtime, and naturally feel military aspirations at a moment like this, will remain unmoved by any one who attempts to taunt them with shirking their duty because they stick to their posts. The problem which every one has to consider at this moment is what is the best form of service that he can give to his country, and I will venture to say that gentlemen of this description can probably do better work for their country by adhering to their Departmental duties than by asking to be enrolled as raw recruits in the Army. The sudden transfer of half-a-dozen efficient clerks from a Public Office would probably do an amount of harm by the disorganisation of the Office which would far outweigh the advantage which could be gained by the addition of so small a number to the volume of recruits whom we are now taking in every day.
House adjourned at twenty-five minutes past Five o'clock, till To-morrow, a quarter past Four o'clock.