Lords Sitting of 1 May 1906

SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE.
The Lord Privy Seal (M. Ripon) acquainted the House that His Majesty had (by Commission) appointed the Earl of Onslow Speaker of the House in the absence of the Lord Chancellor. The said Commission was read.
SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE.
The Lord Privy Seal (M. Ripon) acquainted the House that His Majesty had (by Commission) appointed the Lord Loreburn Speaker of the House; in the absence of the Lord Chancellor, the Earl of Onslow, the Earl of Halsbury, the Earl Waldegrave, the Lord Ribblesdale, and the Lord Balfour of Burleigh. The said Commission was read.

PRIVATE BILL BUSINESS.
Lord Tredegar's Supplemental Estate—;Petition for a Private Bill; together with a copy of the proposed Bill annexed thereto; read, and referred to two English judges.
The LORD CHANCELLORacquainted the House that the Clerk of the Parliaments had laid upon the Table the Certificates from the Examiners that the further Standing Orders applicable to the following Bills have been complied with—;Education Board Provisional Order Confirmation (London, No. 1.) [H.L.]; Education Board Provisional Orders Confirmation (Kestevon, etc.) [H.L.]. Watford Gas.
The same were ordered to lie on the Table.
Clacton Urban District Council Bill [H.L.]. A witness ordered to attend the Select Committee.
Great Northern Railway (Ireland) Bill [H.L.]. A witness ordered to attend the Select Committee.
Cambrian Railways Bill [H.L.]. A witness ordered to attend the Select Committee.
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Shrewsbury Corporation Water Bill Ritz Hotel, Limited—;(Petition for Bill) Crellin's Patents—;(Petition for Bill), Poole Corporation Water Bill, Sutton District Water Bill. Examiner's Certificates of non-compliance with the Standing Orders referred to the Standing Orders Committee on Monday next.
Scottish Union and National Insurance Company Bill [H.L.]. Petition for additional provision; of the Scottish Union and National Insurance Company under their Common Seal together with the proposed amendments annexed thereto; read, and referred to the Examiners.
Lancashire and Yorkshire Railway Bill [H.L.]. The Chairman of Committees informed the House that the opposition to the Bill was withdrawn. The orders made on the 12th of March and the 3rd of April last discharged, and the Bill committed.
Crediton Lighting and Power Bill [H.L.]. The Chairman of Committees informed the House that the opposition to the Bill was withdrawn: the orders made on the 12th of March and the 3rd of April last discharged, and the Bill committed.
Scottish Provident Institution Buildings Bill [H.L.]. Read 2a.
Midland Railway Bill. Brought from the Commons; read 1a; and referred to the Examiners.
Kidderminster Gas Bill [H.L.]. Returned from the Commons agreed to, with amendments; the said amendments considered and agreed to.
Private Legislation Procedure (Scotland) Act, 1899. Report from the Committee of Selection, that the following Lord be proposed to the House as a member of the panel of Lords to act as Commissioners under the Act, viz.: Duke of Argyll, agreed to; and the said Lord appointed accordingly.
Education Board Provisional Orders Confirmation (Devon, etc.) Bill [H.L.]. A Bill to confirm certain Provisional Orders made by the Board of Education under the Education Acts 1870 to 1903,

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to enable the councils of the adminisstrative counties of Devon and the West Riding of Yorkshire to put in force the Lands Clauses Acts. Was presented by the Lord President (Earl Crewe); Read 1a; to be printed, and referred to the Examiners. (No. 61.)

RETURNS, REPORTS, ETC.
  TURKEY, No. 2 (1906.)
  Further paper respecting the affairs of South-Eastern Europe (in continuation of Turkey, No. 1. (1906).

  TRADE REPORTS: ANNUAL SERIES.
  No. 3567. France (Calais).
  No. 3568. Portugal (Beira).
  No. 3569. Turkey (Beirut and the Coast of Syria).
  No. 3570. Denmark (Iceland).

  INTERMEDIATE EDUCATION BOARD (IRELAND.)
  Annual Report for the year 1905.
  Presented (by command), and ordered to lie on the Table.

  LIGHT RAILWAYS ACT, 1896.
  Report of the proceedings of the Board of Trade up to the 31st December 1905, and of the proceedings of the Light Railway Commissioners up to the same date.

  NATIONAL SCHOOL TEACHERS (IRELAND) PENSION FUND.
  Account of receipts and payments in respect of the capital and income of the above fund, for the year ended 31st December 1905.
  Laid before the House (pursuant to Act), and ordered to lie on the table.

PUBLIC HEALTH ACTS (AMENDMENT) BILL [H.L.]
  NOW

    PUBLIC HEALTH ACTS (BUILDING BYE-LAWS) BILL [H.L.]
    Reported from the Standing Committee with Amendments. The Report thereof to be received on Thursday next
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    and Bill to be printed as amended (N° 60.)

    POST OFFICE (MONEY ORDERS) BILL.
    Order of the day for the Second Reading, read, and discharged.

    THE THIBETAN AGREEMENT.
    THE MARQUESS OF LANSDOWNE: I beg to ask the noble Lord the Under-Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs a Question of which I have given him private notice—;namely, whether the Chinese Government have given their adhesion to the Thibetan Agreement of September 7th, 1904, and, if so, whether he is able to inform your Lordships as to the terms upon which that adhesion has been given.
    The UNDER-SECRETARY of STATE for FOREIGN AFFAIRS (Lord FITZ-MAURICE): My Lords, in reply to the question which has just been put to me, I am glad to be able to inform your Lordships that the negotiations which have been for some time proceeding, partly at Calcutta and partly at Pekin, in regard to the adhesion of China to the Convention between this country and Thibet have proved successful. The convention between Great Britain and China was signed at Pekin on April 27th, and it secures the adhesion of China to the Convention established with Thibet in 1904. The text of the Convention has not yet been received, but it will be laid before Parliament in due course. The Convention, however, does not alter the arrangements arrived at under the Convention of Thibet as confirmed by the Government of India. It contains an engagement on our part not to encroach on Thibetan territory nor to interfere in the government of Thibet, the Government of China undertaking on their part not to allow any foreign State to interfere in the government or internal administration of Thibet. It also states that we do not seek for ourselves any of the concessions mentioned in Article 9 of the Convention of Thibet which were denied by that Article to any other State or to the subjects of any other State. The convention with China does not alter the amount of the Thibetan indemnity in any way.

    MACEDONIA.
    LORD MONKSWELL: My Lords, I wish to ask my noble friend the Under-Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs a Question, of which I have given him private notice, with regard to the situation in Macedonia. Your Lordships will recollect that just before Easter the noble Lord the Under-Secretary stated that the Sultan had not yet sanctioned the Iradé for the Macedonian Budgets. The Question I wish to ask is whether the Iradé has since been issued.
    LORD FITZMAURICE: My Lords, I am glad to be able to inform my noble friend that the Iradé has been issued. The authorities in Salonica received information on the 1st of April that it had been issued. I believe the exact date of its issue was the previous day.

    SEED POTATOES SUPPLY (IRELAND) BILL.
    [SECOND READING.]
    Order of the day for the Second Reading read.
    LORD DENMAN: My Lords, I desire to say only a few words in explanation of the necessity for introducing this Bill during the present session. In consequence of the failure during the autumn of 1904 of the potato crop in certain parts of Ireland, the late Government authorised the Local Government Board to put into operation, with the aid of Board of Works loans, a scheme for the supply of seed potatoes similar to those adopted in former years. This, I believe, is really the business of the Department of Agriculture in Ireland, but at the particular time this scheme was put into operation it was not equal to the task of distributing these seed potatoes. The duty, therefore, devolved upon the boards of guardians. In all, some 14,000 tons of seed potatoes were distributed, and the total amount of the loans issued was over £70,000. Last session a Bill was introduced by the late Government authorising these loans and the taking of the proceedings necessary for the working of the scheme, but the Bill was withdrawn at the end of the session. This Bill is brought in to validate the loans made by the Board of Works and the pro-
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    ceedings then taken. In short, it is really a measure to legalise the action of the late Government. In the short debate which took place on the Bill in the House of Commons, Mr. Walter Long, the late Chief Secretary for Ireland, expressed his approval in marked terms, and he earnestly hoped that the measure would receive the support of all sections in the House. The necessity for the pressing of the Bill is urgent, as county councils in Ireland are about to strike their poor rate for the ensuing year. I may mention that in future all schemes of this kind will be taken in hand by the Department of Agriculture and will not be thrown on boards of guardians.
    Moved, "That the Bill be now read 2a."—;(Lord Denman.)
    LORD ASHBOURNE: The noble Lord has very clearly and fairly stated the provisions of this Bill and the necessity for its passing. Prom time to time such measures have been needed in Ireland, and they have generally passed on a fair statement of the necessity for them. I can see no objection to your Lordships according the Bill a Second Reading, though it is quite possible that one or two Amendments will have to be considered in Committee.
    On Question, Bill read 2a (according to order), and committed to a Committee of the Whole House on Thursday next.

    INSURANCE COMPANIES' FUNDS.
    THE EARL OF GRANARD: My Lords, I beg to move, on behalf of the Board of Trade, that the Motion standing in my name be agreed to.
    Moved, "That a Select Committee be appointed to inquire and report what steps should be taken, by deposit of funds or otherwise, to provide adequate security for British policy holders in Life Insurance Companies which have their chief office outside the United Kingdom, but which carry on business in this country."—;(The Earl of Granard.)
    LORD ASHBOURNE: I suppose the terms of the reference have been very

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    fully and closely considered. It is most desirable that such an inquiry should take place, and recent events have rendered the necessity for inquiry more apparent; but on reading the Motion I was disposed to think the terms of reference somewhat narrow. They certainly might have been made wider with advantage, but I presume the Board of Trade are of opinion that the object aimed at will be attained under this reference.
    THE EARL OF GRANARD: I can assure my noble and learned friend that the terms of the reference were very carefully considered by the President of the Board of Trade and other members of the Government before the Motion was placed on the Paper.
    On Question, Motion agreed to.
    Moved, "That the Lords following be named of the Committee; L. Balfour, L. Stanley of Alderley, L. St. Oswald L. Grimthorpe, L. Burghclere."—;(The Earl of Granard.)
    On Question, Motion agreed to.
    The Committee to meet on Monday next, at half-past Three o'clock, and to appoint their own Chairman.

    EGYPTIAN BOUNDARY DISPUTE.
    LORD MONKSWELL: My Lords, in the absence of my noble friend Lord Reay I beg to ask the Under-Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs if Turkish troops have removed the boundary pillars between Egyptian and Turkish territory near El Arisch, and if he can make any statement in regard to the boundary dispute between the Egyptian and Turkish Governments near Akabah and the increase of the garrison in in Egypt.
    LORD FITZMAURICE: My Lords, in reply to my noble friend I have, in the first place, to state that in 1904 the strength of the Egyptian garrison was reduced. Lord Cromer is now of opinion that, in view of the unrest which exists in Egypt and which is in some measure due to the action of the Porte in connection with the frontier, it is desirable to
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    reinforce the garrison. I am informed by my noble friend who represents the War Office in this House that what has been arranged is this—;one battalion goes to Egypt from Malta, three companies go from Crete, and one cavalry regiment and one Horse Artillery battery go from home. A battalion at Malta is also held ready to go if wanted. After the statement had appeared in the Press that Turkish troops had removed the boundary pillars set up by Ishmail Pasha about three miles from the sea shore at El Rafeh and thirty miles to the northeast of El Arisch on the Mediterranean coast, which is part of Egypt, H.M. ship "Minerva" was ordered to proceed to El Arisch to ascertain what had happened and to bring back a report, but that report has not yet been received. Our Ambassador at Constantinople, however, has now been informed by the Grand Vizier that a Commission will be despatched to make inquiries, and, if the pillar is found to been have disturbed, to repair and replace it. Tabah, which is five miles by sea and about nine miles by land from Akabah, following the coast line, and one or two other posts in the Sinai Peninsula, have also been recently occupied by Turkish troops. It is considered that these posts are within the territory which is within the limits of Egyptian administration. The Turkish title to Akabah itself has never been in dispute. I wish rather to insist on that point, because incorrect statements in regard to that matter have been made. The Sinai Peninsula itself has remained in the effective and undisputed possession of the Khedive, though not forming a portion of Egypt proper, from a date many years previous to the accession of Ishmail Pasha. The demands put forward by the Turkish Government have, however, extended far beyond Tabah and its neighbourhood, and have now rendered it necessary that there should be a joint delimitation of the whole frontier on that side, and that, pending a general settlement, the Turkish forces should retire from Tabah. This is what His Majesty's Government have asked from the beginning, but what the Porte has hitherto declined. The Porte is now again being urged to agree to it. As the negotiations are continuing, it would not be desirable

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    at present that I should go beyond the statement which I have just made. I may, however, just add this further observation on the point which I mentioned at the commencement of my statement, that El Rafeh is considered to be within Egypt proper, while, as I have explained, the Sinai Peninsula, though not in Egypt proper, has remained under undisputed Egyptian administration.
    House adjourned at a quarter before Five o'clock, to Thursday next, half-past Ten o'clock.