HL Deb 07 August 1896 vol 44 cc67-70

Where a sale of a holding is made by a landlord to a tenant in consideration of the tenant paying a fine and engaging to pay to the vendor a rent charge, the Land Commission may, if satisfied with the security, make an advance under the Land Purchase Acts as amended by this Act to the tenant for the purposes of such purchase of any sum not exceeding the amount of the fine payable to the landlord, subject as follows:—

  1. (a) The advance shall not exceed the saleable value of the landlord's interest in the holding after deducting such sum as appears to the Land Commission to be the capital value of the rent charge.
  2. (b) The advance shall not be made where the rent charge exceeds half the rent which, in the opinion of the Land Commission, would he a fair rent for the holding.
  3. (c) An ejectment for non-payment of rent shall not be brought in respect of the rent charge.
  4. (d) The rent charge shall be reserved in the vesting order, but the purchase annuity shall have priority over such rent-charge.
  5. (e) The Land Commission may, if satisfied with the security, make a further advance for the redemption of the rent charge in like manner as for the purchase of the holding.
  6. (f) Where a holding is sold under this section the powers conferred by the Land Purchase Acts and this Act for the apportionment of charges shall extend to an apportionment of charges between the purchase money and the rent charge, and the provisions of section fifteen of the Land Law (Ireland) Act, 1887, with respect to the acceptance by an incumbrancer of the purchase money in part discharge of his incumbrance shall apply as if the rent charge were other lands within the meaning of those provisions.


moved at the end of the clause to insert:— In all sales to tenants under this section unless otherwise provided in the vesting order, all easements, rights of shooting, fishing, and hunting, and royalties in or affecting the holding shall be deemed to be reserved to the landlord. The object of the clause was to permit the landowner to sell half the rent to the tenants and to retain a fee farm rent so to speak, and certain privileges. His Amendment was intended to safeguard the sporting rights over an estate in the case of the property being in the hands of a limited owner or where it was held by a minor or a lunatic. Unless the Amendment were adopted the heir in coming into possession might find himself in the position of a mere rent charger and that all his sporting rights had been done away with. He did not think that that was the intention of the Government, and therefore he hoped that the noble Marquess would accept his Amendment.


said that he should support the Amendment which he thought would greatly improve the Bill. He could not see why these sporting rights should not under certain conditions be saved to the landowner. In Ireland sporting rights formed a very important part of the privileges of a landowner and they were also of value to the community. A large income was often derived from letting these sporting rights.


said that it was the desire of the Government that this clause should be a success. He regarded it as one of the most important clauses in the Bill, and as offering a very hopeful solution of the purchase question. Owners would often be willing to sell to their tenants upon easy terms, provided a certain number of the attributes of ownership were reserved to them, and among those attributes the rights of sporting deserved an important place. The point had been provided for in Clause 30, but as that clause had been struck out, he would see that the object of the noble Lord was carried into effect. But if the noble Lord's Amendment were accepted as it stood, the tenant might not know what be was purchasing, and therefore he thought that it would be better that the sporting rights or other rights which the landlord might desire to retain should be reserved by the contract of sale. ["Hear, hear!".]


said that he could scarcely think that it was a very wise proceeding to leave it open for their rights to be disposed of in the case of minors and lunatics.


said that he hoped the noble Marquess would accept the Amendment.


said that in England there was a system of free warren, namely that people who were neither the owners nor the tenants had the power of exercising sporting rights over lands. He thought that in Ireland the precaution should be taken of preventing the tenant from transferring the sporting rights to some one else.


could not see the necessity for the Amendment. Under it the vendor could if he wished part with his sporting rights. He thought they should adhere to the usual custom which was that when a property was sold all its rights went with it


said he desired to meet the cases of people who were either careless of the interest of the middleman, or—like minors or lunatics, unable to protect them. It should be remembered that under the clause the whole state would not be sold, only half the rent would be sold, and unless his Amendment were adopted the remainderman might be deprived of many amenities of the state which he would like to preserve.


said that the Amendment would make the law in Ireland very different from the law in England. If a property were sold in England and no reservation was made of the sporting rights those rights would pass to the occupier. But the Amendment proposed that if the stipulation did not convey those rights they should not pass but should remain with the landlord. It was said that the object of the Amendment was to protect careless landlords. But surely all sales of this kind were taken under competent advice.


said that in many things the law in Ireland was different from the law in England. Many of the vendors would continue to live in Ireland and would therefore desire to retain the sporting rights.


said that vendors had full power to do that under the clause.


said he would not press the Amendment though he was still of opinion that it was a most reasonable one.

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.

Clause ordered to stand part of the Bill.

Clause 3G,—