Lords Sitting of 29 March 1892

POST CARDS.

  QUESTION—OBSERVATIONS.
  LORD LAMINGTON: I beg to ask Her Majesty's Government whether cards conforming in size, weight, and shape with Post Office regulations will be allowed transmission through the post with an adhesive halfpenny stamp, as is already permitted when the matter written on the cards is identical, as in the case of circulars; whether the actual cost of the cards is an expense to the Government, or whether they make a profit on the sale; and, in the latter case, what justification there is for the Government making a profit on the sale of stationery; what objection there is to the public supplying their own cards; and whether, as the question has been some years under the consideration of the Departmental Committee of the Post Office, they have yet come to a decision?
  THE SECRETARY OF STATE FOR INDIA (Viscount CROSS): I have been requested to answer the question of the noble Lord. I am afraid the only answer I can give is that the question is still under the consideration of Her Majesty's Government; that the prices charged to the public leave a slight margin of profit, but against this is to be set the cost of distribution, which is considerable.
  LORD LAMINGTON: My Lords, that would be an argument in favour of allowing the public to supply their own cards.

STAMPING THE HOUR OF COLLECTION ON LETTERS.

  QUESTION—OBSERVATIONS.
  LORD LAMINGTON: I beg to ask Her Majesty's Government whether for the more certain and more rapid transmission of letters, they will adopt the system of stamping the hour of collection on letters as is already done in Canada, Australia, and America, and was once the custom in this country?
  VISCOUNT CROSS: The answer I have to give to the noble Lord is to the following effect:—The adoption of the system of stamping the hour of collection in figures upon all letters passing through the post would not tend to greater certainty or rapidity in the transmission of the letters, and would not be more effective than the present system of postmarks in enabling the Post Office to trace delays; nor would it show the actual hour of posting or the course of the letter, which might have to pass through several offices. It could only show the hour at which the letters were brought into the office at which the first stamping took place. Figures were, it is true, at one time introduced into the London postmarks, but the practice was found to give rise to a good deal of misunderstanding on the part of the public, and to lead to complaints which had no foundation. It was on this account eventually abandoned.

COUNTY COUNCILS AND BILLS, SCOTLAND.

  QUESTION—OBSERVATIONS.
  THE EARL OF CAMPERDOWN: My Lords, it happened that last year on more than one occasion Bills were brought forward which affected county finance and county administration in Scotland, and that those Bills passed, or very nearly passed through Parliament without the County Councils having had an opportunity of expressing any opinion upon them. I brought the matter under the notice of the Secretary of State for Scotland last year, and he told me that he would take steps to convey the information in future in such cases to the County Councils. My Lords, during the present Session one Bill has been introduced and passed through this House so rapidly that it was impossible for the County Councils to consider it, and there are pending in the other House at the present time Bills, some introduced by private Members, and I think one, at all events, introduced by the Government which also the County Councils have had no opportunity of considering. I should like therefore to ask the Secretary for Scotland what steps have been taken to ensure that

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  all Bills specially affecting counties in Scotland should be brought under the notice of the County Councils in Scotland before being passed by Parliament?
  THE SECRETARY FOR SCOTLAND (the Marquess of LOTHIAN): I suppose the noble Earl is referring to what I stated last year on the Amendment to the Public Health (Scotland) Act Amendment Act when I said that I had given instructions that if possible such Bills should be distributed to the County Councils before they passed through Parliament. I stated at the same time that it was not part of my official duty to do so. I may state that I had made arrangements and hoped it would have been possible to carry them into effect, but I found, in endeavouring to do so, that really in practice it was not feasible. I think the noble Earl will agree with me that, unless this proposal which he now makes could be carried out in its entirety, it would be very undesirable to try it at all; because the County Councils would rely upon the Scotch Office to send them all Bills, whether private or public, and, if they did not get them, they would suppose that the Bills had either been dropped or were not to be pressed. I think that would be a very undesirable state of affairs. My Lords, the fact is that it is quite impossible for my Office to undertake this duty. What had always been done previously to the passing of the Local Government (Scotland) Act was that those interested in any Bill, the Commissioners of Supply, either through agents in London or through Members of Parliament who might be interested in them, always had the Bills sent down to them for consideration; and I cannot see why that system should not now be carried into effect. I am afraid I cannot undertake, on the part of the Government, to forward every Bill, either public or private, to the County Councils for their consideration. At the same time I hope the noble Earl will not misunderstand me; I trust he will bear me out in saying that I have consulted, as my desire is on all possible occasions to consult, the views of the County Councils before legislation is passed—I mean in all practical and proper ways. My Lords, the Roads
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  and Bridges (Scotland) Bill, to which my noble Friend referred, is a Bill that affects the County Councils very considerably I admit; but, as I stated to your Lordships at the time, I was unable to postpone that Bill, even if Amendments might be desired, because it is absolutely necessary that the Bill should pass through Parliament without any delay whatever. If that Bill had been referred to the County Councils it would not have been possible to pass it before June or July, which would have been much too late for the purposes with which it is intended the Bill should deal. Therefore, while I am afraid I cannot undertake to send all Bills to the County Councils for consideration, my answer to the noble Earl is that I will do what I have hitherto done—take every proper step to ascertain their views upon any Bill that may be brought before Parliament.

  CONVEYANCING AND LAW OF PROPERTY ACT, 1881, AMENDMENT BILL.
  Reported from the Standing Committee with amendments; the Report thereof to be received on Thursday next; and Bill to be printed as amended. (No. 55.)
  POOR LAW (IRELAND) AMENDMENT BILL.
  Reported from the Standing Committee without amendment; and to be read 3a on Thursday next.
LABOURERS (IRELAND) ALLOTMENTS BILL.
  HARES BILL.
  Reported from the Standing Committee, with an amendment to each Bill; the Report thereof to be received on Thursday next.

  LOCAL GOVERNMENT (SCOTLAND) ORDER (GLASGOW, &C.) BILL [H.L.]
  A Bill to confirm an Order of the Boundary Commissioners for Scotland, relating to the burgh and city of Glasgow, the burgh of Renfrew, and to the parishes of Cathcart, Eastwood, Govan, and Renfrew, in the Counties of Lanark and Renfrew—Was presented by the Lord Ker (M. Lothian); read 1a; to be printed, and referred to the Examiners. (No. 56.)
  House adjourned at twenty minutes before Six o'clock.