Lords Sitting of 10 March 1891

TITHE RENTCHARGE RECOVERY BILL—(No. 38).
Reported from the Standing Committee with further Amendments: The Report of the Amendments made in Committee of the whole House and by the Standing Committee to be received on Thursday next; and Bill to be printed as amended. (No. 55.)

RAILWAY RATES AND CHARGES PROVISIONAL ORDER BILL.
Commons Message considered (according to order).
Moved, "That this House do concur in the following Resolution communicated by the Commons," namely—
"That all Bills of the present Session to con-firm Provisional Orders made by the Board of Trade, under the 'Railway and Canal Traffic Act, 1888,' containing the classification of merchandise traffic, and the schedule of maximum rates and charges applicable thereto, be referred to a Joint Committee of Lords and Commons."—(The Lord Balfour.)
Agreed to; and a Message sent to the Commons to acquaint them therewith.

ELEMENTARY EDUCATION (BLIND AND DEAF) BILL [H.L.]—(No. 43).
Amendments reported (according to order).
THE LORD PRESIDENT OF THE COUNCIL (Viscount CRANBROOK): My Lords, I beg to move the Amendments which stand in my name. They are in
Clause 11, page 4, line 4, after ("regards,") insert ("its"), and after ("school") insert ("or institution"); leave out all after ("jurisdiction") in line 10 to ("and that") in line 13; after line 15 insert—" (2) In determining the amount of such reasonable weekly sum to be paid by the parent, the Court shall take into consideration the means of the parent, and any special circumstances affecting the particular case, and, if the child be of like condition with the children attending the public elementary schools of the neighbourhood, then the ordinary weekly fee charged in such schools"; lines 16 and 17, leave out ("this order") and insert ("any order made under this Section").
*LORD NORTON: My Lords, I desire to say a few words in explanation of an Amendment which I have upon the one proposed by the noble Lord the Lord
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President of the Council after line 15, which perhaps may induce him to think that the wording of this Amendment must be altered. The Amendment proposes that in determining the weekly amount to be paid by the parent—
"The Court shall take into consideration the means of the parent and any special circumstances,"
those must be, I suppose, the parents condition as labourers or tradesmen, and the blindness of the child; and then it provides that—
"If the child be of like condition with the children attending the public elementary schools of the neighbourhood,"
the parent is to pay the ordinary weekly fee charged in such schools. Now, there may be many conditions of children attending any elementary school. In almost all rural schools there are the children of labourers and of tradesmen and farmers, and there are different classes also in towns. I propose, therefore; instead of those words—
"If the child be of like condition with the children attending the public elementary schools,"
to insert—
"The fee charged for a blind or deaf child at such school or institution shall not exceed the maximum fee paid for children of like condition at public elementary schools of the neighbourhood."
That I think would take in all the conditions.
*VISCOUNT CRANBROOK: My noble Friend will misunderstand the mode in which my clause is drawn. There is no such provision in it as he apparently supposes. What is provided in the Amendment I propose is this: that in determining the amount to be paid the Court shall take into consideration certain circumstances because they will have to deal with children of all classes, but that if the child be of like condition with those attending the public elementary schools in the place, then, in addition to all the special circumstances, they are to take into consideration the fee ordinarily charged; not that they are to make the parent of that child pay a particular fee, for the child may be one who in the ordinary course would be exempted, but they are to fix the weekly sum including maintenance, education, and other things, for which they think the parent ought to pay. Where it is a case in which the child

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would otherwise go to an ordinary school they will take into consideration what the payment in that ordinary school would be, and then, taking into consideration all the circumstances of the case, make the parent pay what they consider a proper weekly sum, such as he can afford. My noble Friend seems to read it as laying down what the Courts are to do in regard only to one particular thing, which of course would make the clause altogether nonsense. They are to determine a reasonable sum to he paid for the whole thing, taking into consideration all those circumstances, and then, when the child is of a particular class, that is of like condition with the children attending the public elementary schools in the neighbourhood, also the question of the ordinary weekly fee charged in those schools.
*LORD NORTON: I cannot understand that the "ordinary fee" means the fee which any parent can pay for extraordinary education. However, after what the noble Lord has said I beg to withdraw my Amendment.
Amendment (by leave of the House) withdrawn.
Original Amendment agreed to.
Bill to be read 3a on Thursday next; and to be printed as amended. (No.56.)

MUSEUMS AND GYMNASIUMS BILL—(No. 57.) SEED POTATOES SUPPLY (IRELAND) ACT, 1890, AMENDMENT BILL—(No. 58.)
Brought from the Commons; read 1a, and to be printed.
House adjourned at a quarter before Six o'clock, to Thursday next, a quarter past Ten o'clock.