QUESTION. OBSERVATIONS. (Hansard, 2 April 1889)

§ VISCOUNT SIDMOUTH
, in rising to call attention to the Naval Defence Act, 1888, so far as that Act affects the duties and liabilities of the Royal Naval Artillery Volunteer Corps, said: My Lords, in reply to a question put in the House of Commons on Tuesday last, the First Lord of the Admiralty is reported to have said that— 1373 As the Act of 1873 now stands, the Royal Naval Artillery Volunteers are not liable for service away from their own ports, except in case of invasion or apprehended invasion; so that, except in this contingency, the Admiralty, under the existing Act, have no means of availing themselves of their services. The Admiralty would he glad to give encouragement to this force when they can see a way of advantageously employing them. They are ready to supply guns, ammunition, and instruction; but they cannot undertake to supply ships for local ports. Now, if the Corps merely existed under the Act of 1873, the noble Lord would have been perfectly right, but the Act which was passed last year, called the Naval Defence Act, altered the situation, and repealed a portion of the Act of 1873. I will just read the alteration which the last Act produced. Section 3 enacts— Whenever an Order is in force directing that the Royal Naval Reserve, or any part thereof, shall be called into actual service, it shall be lawful for Her Majesty the Queen to direct the Admiralty to call out for actual service the Naval Artillery Volunteer Corps, or any of them, and such directions shall have full effect as a direction under Section 16 of the Naval Artillery Volunteers Act, 1873, and that Act shall have effect accordingly. So that the argument of the Admiralty as regards the localizing of the Corps is rendered incorrect by this Act of Parliament. I hope your Lordships will excuse me for placing this very important difference before the House. It was stated by the First Lord the other night that the Admiralty would have difficulty in finding work for the corps to do. But if the Naval Reserve are called into active service, the Coast Guard and Marines would be taken from their present posts, and it would be perfectly natural that their places should be filled by a body of trained men such as the Naval Volunteers. I do not wish to detain the House by enlarging upon the subject, because your Lordships heard it discussed at length the other evening; but I cannot forbear stating that, in consequence of what passed the other night, I received a letter from a highly distinguished officer nearly at the head of his profession—an officer who has been engaged specially for the purpose of superintending the Royal Naval Reserve. This officer writes in the very highest terms of the Naval Volunteers, and speaks of them as "a well educated body, full of zeal, longing to be of practical use in 1374 the Navy, and well drilled, and serving without pay." I may ask your Lordships to remember that the Naval Volunteer Corps was made use of in the French War, under the name of the Sea Fencibles, consisting of, I think, some 30,000 to 50,000 men; on one occasion, I believe they were actually made use of by Lord Nelson himself. I hope in what I have said on this subject I shall not be supposed to have intended to pass any slight on the present Board of Admiralty. As far as my opinion is worth anything, I think they have taken more positive steps towards the formation and organization of a competent Navy than have been taken by any Board of Admiralty within my recollection. I shall be glad to learn from the noble Lord who represents the Admiralty in this House, whether I am correct in the view which I put upon the Act of last year.

§ *LORD ELPHINSTONE
Before I approach the question of the noble Lord, I would like to make this observation. There appears to be an impression abroad that the Admiralty wish to discourage rather than encourage the Royal Naval Artillery Volunteers. As I said the other night, the Admiralty fully recognize the zeal and the energy displayed by that corps, and appreciate the willingness with which they come forward at great personal inconvenience to themselves, in order to learn and become masters of the various parts of their drill. In the course of the discussion the other evening my noble Friend who has just spoken referred to a speech made by the First Lord of the Admiralty, which he said had caused a considerable amount of pain to the Naval Volunteers. I immediately took upon myself to reply that I felt perfectly sure that my noble Friend in the House of Commons had not, in anything he had said, the slightest wish to reflect in any way upon the corps. My noble Friend Lord Ravensworth expressed his satisfaction at the disclaimer I made—a disclaimer which he said would have the effect of soothing the feelings of many of the Volunteers who, from misconception of what had been said in another place, felt very much aggrieved. Unfortunately, that disclaimer of mine did not find its way into the public Press, and I take this opportunity of repeating it, and I have the authority of the First Lord for saying 1375 that in all that he said nothing was further from his idea or intention or wish than to reflect in any way upon the corps. There are no doubt very great difficulties as to the employment of these Naval Volunteers. In addition to the capitation grant which was given by the present First Lord, the Admiralty undertake to provide guns and ammunition and instruction, but they have always from the outset declined to give ships for the purpose of training the Volunteers. They feel that the chief value—in fact the chief duty—of these Volunteers in the event of war would be to assist in the defence of the various mercantile ports. In those mercantile ports are many vessels of sufficient size to carry guns. They are handled by men who know every yard of the water in their own locality, and the Admiralty feel that that is the field for these Volunteers—that is the place where they might be most effectually made use of. Having provided instruction for these Volunteers, the Admiralty do not think it is unreasonable to expect that the various ports in which these small vessels exist should provide, for the purpose of their defence, vessels in which to put the Volunteers. The Admiralty cannot localize any of their men-of-war for the defence of any special port. They must have—I am sure any Government will insist upon this—a free hand. They must be able to send ships at any moment to any part of the world where they may be required. As I said the other evening, the Admiralty would gladly welcome any suggestion that could be made for the better utilizing of this corps. With regard to the military Volunteers, they are provided with arms and ammunition, and they take care of themselves. On the other hand, the Naval Volunteers are provided with arms and ammunition, but they require the Admiralty to provide them ships for the purpose of training. Vessels have to be, and are at times, diverted from their regular duties, but it is only at considerable inconvenience to the public service, and the Admiralty are not unnaturally, under these circumstances, reluctant to add to their burden by the increase of a force that requires these special facilities to enable them to train. As I said the other evening, by the Act under which the corps is embodied, they could not be called 1376 upon to serve away from their own ports except in cases of "apprehended invasion." But I should have added in case of "imminent national danger" or "great emergency." It is perfectly true that the Act allows the Volunteers to be called out on the same emergency as the Royal Naval Reserve, and that when called out they may be employed on board of any ship engaged in the defence of the coasts, the Channel Islands, the Isle of Man, and the seas adjacent. But suppose they were wanted suddenly to go to the Mediterranean or to some more distant point: any individual Volunteer could claim, under the Act under which he is enrolled, to be removed from the ship. It is only by his own consent that he could be taken from the coasts immediately adjacent to this country. That is the great difference between the Royal Naval Volunteers and the Royal Naval Reserve. Unless there is a larger field for the utilization of these Volunteers than now exists, the Admiralty feel some hesitation as to any extension of the Corps. I have heard it said—and I believe my noble Friend will corroborate the statement—that the Volunteers are only too anxious to go to any part of the world where they may be required. I do not know whether that is true or not, but I am delighted to hear it; and I have not the slightest doubt that, if the occasion arose, they would serve with credit to themselves and advantage to the country. But I would like to know whether that statement applies simply to the London Corps or to the whole body of Naval Volunteers.

§ VISCOUNT SIDMOUTH
I believe that the whole corps are perfectly of the same feeling as the London Corps.

§ *LORD ELPHINSTONE
I am very glad to hear it. What is proposed by the Admiralty is this—that representatives of the various corps should meet and agree upon some common course of action for the employment of Volunteers in time of war, either by co-operating in manning vessels, or in any other way that offers a satisfactory solution of what is really a difficult problem. If they do that, the Admiralty will be prepared to appoint an officer to meet and confer with them, in the hope of arriving at a satisfactory conclusion. I think, my Lords, that suggestion on 1377 the part of the Admiralty ought to satisfy the wishes and views, as at present expressed, of the Naval Volunteer Corps.

§ VISCOUNT SIDMOUTH
I think the suggestion of the Admiralty is a very excellent one, and one which will be gladly received by the Volunteer officers. What they complain of, amongst other things, is that they have not been in the past sufficiently consulted in matters respecting their organization.

§ *LORD ELPHINSTONE
I hope the noble Viscount will not misunderstand me. We suggest that the different corps should consult with each other and propound a scheme. Having done that, the Admiralty will be prepared to appoint an officer to confer with them and go into the matter.

§ VISCOUNT SIDMOUTH
I am sure the corps will gladly accept the suggestion.