Lords Sitting of 24 March 1887

MINUTES.
PUBLIC BILL—Third Reading—Pharmacy Acts Amendment *(28), and passed.
AFRICA (SOUTH)—AFFAIRS OF SWAZILAND.

  QUESTION. OBSERVATIONS.
  VISCOUNT MIDLETON,in rising to ask the Under Secretary of State for the Colonies, Whether the attention of the Government has been called to the probability of a filibustering attack being made upon Swaziland; whether any communications have been made to the Transvaal Government on the subject, or what other steps the Government propose to take in the matter? said, he would briefly state the reasons which had induced him to place the Question on the Paper. It would be in the recollection of their Lordships, that, after the Convention of London, a line of frontier was traced by competent Commissioners with great accuracy, and marked out with large cairns of stones; and so it remained until about a year ago. Papers had since been placed in the hands of their Lordships which showed that a Boer, who was known only by his Caffre name, but whom there was no difficulty in identifying, had removed the boundary stones, and had substituted others at a very considerable distance from the true boundary; and a messenger from the Transvaal Government had demanded that the people within the altered boundary should admit the Suzerainty of the Transvaal Government the reply was, that they relied on British protection. But they were reminded that the British Forces had been beaten not so long ago at Majuba Hill, and that there was not much to be expected from that quarter the people of Swaziland then sent to the Acting Commissioner at Natal, stating their grievance, and asking for advice. A remonstrance was sent to the Transvaal Government, who took no notice of it. A telegram was then sent, and the reply was, that the matter was still under consideration, and that the facts had not yet been ascertained. A

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  despatch had been sent from this country approving the action of the Natal Government; but he wished the despatch had gone further, and urged more energetic action on the part of those who had an opportunity of dealing with the subject, and that they should be enjoined to bring the matter to a conclusion at the earliest possible moment. The longer the question of this dispute with the Transvaal Government was allowed to go on, the greater would be the difficulty of dealing with it. It would have been much easier to settle the matter at first, because at that time the Transvaal Government were in financial difficulties; but since then it had transpired that Swaziland was very rich in gold, being probably the richest of all the Gold Fields discovered in South Africa, and the discovery of gold within this territory had made a considerable difference to them, and would explain the reason why the Boers had cast longing eyes upon it. The information which he had received was that there was a probability of a filibustering attack on Swaziland; and it was believed that the expedition would receive, if not the active encouragement, at least the tacit assent, of the Government in Pretoria. What was absolutely necessary now was, that we should send a British Resident to Swaziland, which the Swazi King seemed inclined to consider the best course; or, if we did not do that, we should notify very plainly to the Government of the South African Republic that we would not tolerate the invasion, whether on a largo or small scale, of a territory which was virtually under our protection. We should further declare that if, in spite of our remonstrances, any Transvaal subjects were found fighting in the ranks of those who invaded Swaziland, a considerable fine would be imposed on everyone so found; and, if we should be driven to extreme measures, we should take possession of the Gold Fields on the frontier of the Transvaal, and retain them, as security, until a considerable indemnity was paid. Unless we spoke out clearly, distinctly, and in a manner which could not be mistaken on this subject, we might find ourselves landed in serious trouble. The information had reached him from a person on the spot, who had had many years' experience of these frontier troubles, to the effect that not only did very great anxiety exist on
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  the subject within the borders of the Colony, but that the preparations which were being made in the Transvaal territory for the purpose of taking advantage of any weakness on our part were perfectly notorious and undenied, even by those engaged in them; and he asked whether the attention of the Government had been called to what was going on, and what steps they proposed to take in the matter?
  THE UNDER SECRETARY OF STATE FOR THE COLONIES (The Earl of ONSLOW),in reply, said, that Her Majesty's Government were fully alive to all that was going on in South Africa at the present moment. The description given by the noble Viscount as to the course of events, up to the publication of the latest Blue Book, was entirely accurate; but since that publication was issued the Government had received information that four Swaziland Chiefs had received a message from the Landrost of Wakkerstroom, stating he would march into and annex the country. A communication was immediately sent to the Transvaal Government, in reply to which they denied having given any such authority to the Landrost. Sir Hercules Robinson had since been asked to call the attention of the Transvaal Government again to the subject, and ask for an explanation, and to point out that, pending that explanation, any violation of the territory of Swaziland, except with the consent of the Swazi King, would be considered as an infraction of the Convention of London. The Transvaal Government again denied the truth of the statements which had been made with reference to a probable expedition against Swaziland, and had furnished proofs in support of their denial. They said that if encroachments were made they would be found to be acts of individual Boers, who were beyond the jurisdiction and control of the Transvaal Government. There could be no doubt that the discovery of gold in Swaziland had brought into it a very mixed and somewhat turbulent population, and that the state of the country was far from settled; but, as far as the action of this Government was concerned, it was entirely governed by the terms of the Convention of 1884, which echoed the provisions of the Convention of Pretoria, and stipulated that the independence of Swaziland,

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  within the prescribed bounds, would be fully recognized. The annexation of Swaziland by this country had been proposed in some quarters. It had been said that, inasmuch as the settlement of Zululand had been accomplished without any cost to the British taxpayer, it might reasonably be hoped that a settlement of Swaziland might be accomplished on similar terms. That might be so; but such a proceeding would be in direct violation of the Treaty. No doubt, if any attempt wore made to violate the independence of Swaziland, and a request were made by the Swazi King, Her Majesty's Government might be justified in affording him such assistance as might be necessary to protect the independence of his country. The King had himself, of his own accord, invited the assistance of Mr. Shepstone, a gentleman exceptionally well acquainted with the affairs of South Africa, who was now with the King, not as the Representative of Her Majesty's Government, or of the Colonial Government, but at the King's own request; and it was sincerely to be hoped that his presence in Swaziland would be of much use. The noble Viscount had said that, virtually, Swaziland was under the protection of England; but he (the Earl of Onslow) could not quite agree with that statement. The only authority for such a statement was contained in the Second Article of the Convention of London, which said that Her Majesty's Government might, if they deemed it necessary, appoint Commissioners in the Native territory outside the Eastern and Western Borders of the South African Republic to maintain order and prevent encroachment. It was perfectly clear, therefore, that power was possessed by Her Majesty's Government to go to that extent; and at the present time the question of appointing such Commissioners! was receiving their very serious and anxious consideration. With regard to what fell from the noble Viscount, as to the possibility of any interference in the country between Natal and Delagoa Bay by any of the Great Powers of Europe, as far, at any rate, as Germany was concerned, to which Empire he presumed the noble Viscount alluded, his apprehensions might be safely sot at rest by the exchange of communications which took place between Earl Granville, when Foreign Secretary, and Count Minister. In those
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  communications Germany declared herself ready to withdraw her protest against the hoisting of the British Flag at St. Lucia Bay, and her intention not to establish any Protectorate over the territory between Delagoa Bay and Natal. But as to the apprehension of filibustering expeditions, there was, no doubt, considerable foundation for alarm, and Her Majesty's Government were considering the matter with very great care, especially with regard to the appointment of Commissioners under the Convention of London.

ARMY (AUXILIARY FORCES)—HELMETS FOR THE MILITIA REGIMENTS.

  QUESTION. OBSERVATIONS.
  LORD FITZGERALD,in rising to ask the Under Secretary of State for the War Department, Whether it is intended to supply helmets for the use of the privates of the several Militia regiments so as to enable them to take part in the training and celebrations of Her Most Gracious Majesty's Jubilee year in full and proper costume? said, that for some time the anomaly had been presented of the officers of Militia wearing helmets and of the non-commissioned officers and men wearing the Glengarry. When the present territorial system was instituted, and Militia regiments wore constituted third and fourth battalions of Line regiments, there was an understanding that they should be placed as nearly as possible, so far as dress and accoutrements were concerned, on the same footing as soldiers of the Line. Notwithstanding this, the rank and file of the Militia had been kept for years without helmets, and with no other head-dress than the ordinary Glengarry bonnet. That they had to wear in all weathers, and under all circumstances, although the Glengarry was very little protection from the rain, and none at all from the wind and sun. It was especially hard on men, usually in civil attire, to have their hair cut close, and to be compelled continuously to wear a cap which was no protection from the weather. Moreover, it was highly objectionable in a military point of view that on field days, when the troops had to be in review order, the Militia could not turn out properly dressed. While both the Line and the Volunteers appeared on such occasions in helmets, the

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  Militia, although they might be in the same brigade, could not wear the same headdress. There were plenty of helmets which could be served out, and he trusted that, at least on the occasion of Her Majesty's Jubilee, the 10,000 Militia who would take part in the Review would not be allowed to appear without helmets.
  THE UNDER SECRETARY OF STATE FOR WAR (Lord HARRIS),in reply, said, that with regard to the supply of helmets to Militia regiments taking part in the Review to be held on July 9 the arrangements for that Review wore not yet complete in detail; but in making the arrangements the point referred to by the noble and learned Lord should not be overlooked. With regard to the issue of helmets to Militia regiments during their training, it had been laid down by Lord Cardwell and Lord Cranbrook that, while disembodied, the Militia should wear undress uniform of the territorial regiments to which they were attached, and the Secretary of State was of opinion that to change this order would be inadvisable at the present moment.
  THE EARL OF STRAFFORDsaid, that formerly the Militia wore the shako in full dress, and he could see no reason why they should not now wear the helmet.
  LORD HARRISsaid, that the question of the issue of helmets to the Militia had been gone into at full length by a Commission and decided in the manner he had stated.

NORTH-EASTERN ASIA—THE COREA—FOREIGN OCCUPATION OF PORT HAMILTON.

  MOTION FOR AN ADDRESS.
  VISCOUNT SIDMOUTH,in rising to move for copy of any written pledges, should such pledges exist, on the part of the Empires of Russia and China with the Government of this country in reference to the occupation for military or naval purposes of the harbour of Port Hamilton or any portion of the territory of Corea, said, that their Lordships would remember that, although naval testimony was unanimous as to the insufficiency of the harbour, yet there was no doubt that it only required money to be spent at Port Hamilton to make it a very important naval and military position. Although this country might be unwilling to lay out the money for this
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  purpose, yet other nations might not object to spend the money necessary to make Port Hamilton an impregnable fortress if they obtained the chance, He ventured to urge upon the Government, in view of the importance of the rapid development of China by way of the North Pacific, that they should apply themselves to discover some place which might be used as a great naval depot and harbour in those seas. The noble Viscount concluded by moving for the Address of which he had given Notice.
  Moved, "That an humble Address be presented to Her Majesty for copy of any written pledges, should such pledges exist, on the part of the Empires of Russia and China with the Government of this country in reference to the occupation for military or naval purposes of the harbour of Port Hamilton or any portion of the territory of Corea."—(The Viscount Sidmouth.)
  THE LORD PRESIDENT OF THE COUNCIL (Viscount CRANBROOK),in reply, said, that the Papers to which his noble Friend referred contained a statement, and a very full written statement, on the part of the Chinese Government, giving the guarantee in question, which was not a mere verbal statement by the Chinese Government, but was a very deliberate Note. It was found that the Chinese had received from the Russian Government a guarantee that Russia would not interfere with Corean territory in future if the British did not; and the Chinese Government, on the faith of that guarantee, had given the British Government a written guarantee that neither China nor Russia would interfere with the territory in question. That was accepted by Sir John Walsham, who telegraphed home, and received the assent of my noble Friend (the Marquess of Salisbury) to the guarantee, as coming from the Chinese Government.
  VISCOUNT SIDMOUTHasked, whether her Majesty's Government had a guarantee from the Russian Government?
  VISCOUNT CRANBROOKsaid, the guarantee, as far as England was concerned, was from the Chinese Government, who had the Corea under its Suzerainty. They had received a guarantee from Russia; but with Russia Her Majesty's Government in this matter had no concern.
  LORD ELLENBOROUGHsaid, that a war between Russia and China was not

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  a very impossible event, and that, therefore, the guarantee was worthless.
  VISCOUNT SIDMOUTHasked, whether China had received a written guarantee from Russia?
  VISCOUNT CRANBROOK: I cannot tell that.
  VISCOUNT SIDMOUTH: As there are no more Papers to be produced, I must ask leave to withdraw my Motion.
  Motion (by leave of the House) withdrawn.
  House adjourned at Five o'clock, till To-morrow, a quarter past Ten o'clock.