RESOLUTION. (Hansard, 10 May 1886)

§ VISCOUNT SIDMOUTH,
in moving— That the Navy Estimates for the present year he laid on the Table of this House, complained of the manner in which his Motion had been treated by the Government when he brought it forward a short time ago, and contended that inasmuch as naval discussions frequently arose in this House, it was essential that the Estimates should be laid on the Table.

§ THE FIRST LORD OF THE ADMIRALTY (The Marquess of RIPON)
said, it had not been the practice hitherto to lay these Estimates before their Lordships, and he thought it was very undesirable that either the Army or the Navy Estimates should be so introduced. At the same time, he should be most happy at all times to answer any Question which related to the Navy which the noble Viscount or any other Member of their Lordships' House might address to him.

§ THE MARQUESS OF SALISBURY
said, he did not agree that the present state of things was perfectly satisfactory. The Navy Estimates gave a picture of policy, and one on which they could pass an opinion; and it appeared to him that 559 the fact of the First Lord of the Admiralty having a seat in that House necessarily meant that he should defend himself if he was attacked there. Two years ago he made some observations on the subject of the Navy. The noble Earl then at the head of the Admiralty (the Earl of Northbrook) thought those observations were unfounded, and took him to task for introducing the subject in that House. The discussion of the question could only be adequately carried on by their Lordships when they had the Estimates before them, and it was most inconvenient that their Lordships should have to run to the Library for the information they required for the purpose. On the occasion to which he referred, moreover, it was the noble Earl (the Earl of Northbrook) himself who brought the subject forward, and gave them a long dissertation on ships and torpedoes. It was not a question of encroachment on the rights of the other House; and he would suggest that it would be consistent with precedent if, on the Motion of any noble Lord, a message might be sent to the House of Commons asking them that the Estimates might be presented to their Lordships. That course, he thought, could not cause any jealousy as to privilege.

THE SECRETARY OF STATE FOR INDIA (The Earl of KIMBERLEY)
said, he thought the suggestion of the noble Marquess would go rather a long way, because it would apply equally to other Estimates besides those of the Navy. There was the Education Department, and the Vice President was in the other House. Would they have the Education Estimate presented in that House because the Lord President sat there? Then there was the Board of Works. It would hardly be contended that the Estimates of that Department should be laid before their Lordships. It could not be made dependent on the accident that the Representative of a Department was in that House. It must be a general practice or not at all.

§ VISCOUNT SIDMOUTH
withdrew the Motion on the understanding that the noble Marquess would consent to consider the subject.

THE DUKE OF RICHMOND AND GORDON
did not like it to go forth to the public that his noble Friend the Lord President (Earl Spencer) was subordinate 560 to any official in the Education Department.

§ THE MARQUESS OF RIPON
promised to communicate with the Leader of the House (Earl Granville), and to consider the suggestion of the noble Marquess.

§ THE MARQUESS OF SALISBURY
said, he did not wish that it should be always done; but that it should be competent for any Member of that House to move for these Estimates.