HL Deb 23 June 1886 vol 307 cc195-7

(The Lord FitzGerald.)

Commons reasons for disagreeing to some of the Lords amendments considered (according to order).

Commons reasons for disagreeing to amendments made by the Lords as far as the amendment in page 4, line 40, read.

Moved, "That this House doth not insist on the amendments to which the Commons have disagreed."—(The Lord FilzGerald.)

Motion agreed to.

LORD FITZGERALD

said, he wished also to move that the House do not insist on its Amendment cutting out Clause 11, which gave compulsory powers of purchase. This clause was the backbone of the Bill, and if its omission was insisted on it would lead to its promoters abandoning the Bill altogether.

Moved, "That this House doth not insist on the omission of Clause 11."—(The Lord Fits Gerald.)

LORD ASHBOURNE

said, he was desirous of seeing this Bill pass, which improved the machinery of the previous Labourers Act, and with that view he had not asked the House to insist on other Amendments. But this Clause 11 was one that there had been difficulty in accepting, as it sought to amend legislation which had only been granted last August, and which had hardly been tried. His noble and learned Friend had not stated that in any single part of Ireland there had been any difficulty in getting all the land that was asked for or required by simple agreement. When the Bill was before the House on a former occasion his noble Friend behind him stated that when asked to give by agreement some land near the town of Longford he at once consented, but he never heard anything more of the matter. It ought to be shown that all the means of getting land by agreement had been exhausted before they were asked to resort to compulsion.

THE EARL OF BELMORE

said, that those who took an interest in the matter were unwilling to stop the Bill. They were content to move some Amendments in order to make the clause more precise. He would propose an Amendment to the effect that all reasonable efforts should be made to obtain the amount of land in the same locality by agreement or exchange.

LORD FITZGERALD

said, that he would accept the Amendment of the noble Earl.

Amendment (The Earl of Belmore) agreed to.

THE EARL OF LONGFORD

proposed that a Provisional Order on this subject should not take effect until it had been confirmed by Act of Parliament.

THE SECRETARY OF STATE FOR INDIA (The Earl of KIMBERLEY)

hoped that the noble Earl would not insist on moving that Amendment, seeing the great trouble and expense which would be imposed on persons if they were obliged to come over to Parliament.

THE MARQUESS OF SALISBURY

said, that the clause was of a very exceptional character, and it was very important that Parliament should retain in its own hands the power of deciding whether that great and unusual authority was exercised properly or not. They knew that there were social difficulties in Ireland which might make Local Authorities not so unwilling as they otherwise would be to sanction plans which might be oppressive to individuals.

THE EARL OF LONGFORD

said, that it would not be necessary that every case should be fought out in Parliament; in fact, Provisional Orders were very rarely disputed.

LORD FITZGERALD

said, that the provision of the Act which required persons to come to Parliament had been deliberately given up, and the sanction of the Lord Lieutenant and Privy Council had been deliberately substituted as a sufficient protection.

Amendment (The Earl of Longford) (by leave of the House) withdrawn.

On Question, "That this House doth not insist on the omission of Clause 11?"

Resolved in the affirmative.

Bill returned to the Commons, with the amendments.