§ THE MARQUESS OF SALISBURYSeeing the noble Earl the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs early in his place, I wish to ask him whether he is able to give any information to the House on two important matters which occupy public attention—namely, the negotiations with respect to the Afghan Frontier, and those with reference to the suppression of The Bosphore Egyptien?
§ EARL GRANVILLEIn answer to the noble Marquess I shall give all the 1471 information in our power as to the two questions to which he refers. It is as follows:—The Bosphore Egyptien was suppressed by a lawful decree of the Egyptian Government, and the British Government gave its sanction to the act. The French Government, while wholly refraining from questioning the suppression of the newspaper (1) declared the seizure of the paper and closing of the printing office, in which other business was carried on, to be illegal; and (2) complained of the forcible removal of the French Consul, who had attended personally to protest against the closure of the office. The French Government demanded—(1) there-opening of the office; and (2) the punishment of the persons concerned in the act. In the meanwhile, Her Majesty's Government had obtained full Reports from Sir Evelyn Baring as to all the circumstances, and had taken advice as to the legal bearings of the case. The conclusion to which Her Majesty's Government came was, that the closure of the office was not warranted by law, and that the technical force used against the French Consular authorities was, therefore, not justifiable. We, therefore, took note of the declaration of the French Government, that there was no desire to shield The Bosphore Egyptien; that they wholly refrained from raising any question as to the suppression of the newspaper; and, further, that they expressed their readiness to withdraw their demand for the punishment of those who acted tinder the orders of the Egyptian Government. Accordingly we stated that Her Majesty's Government, who do not disclaim responsibility for the decision to suppress the newspaper, were ready to associate themselves with the regret which they have advised the Government of the Khedive to express as to the incidents which have attended the suppression. Her Majesty's Government advised Nubar Pasha to re-open the office, and that his Excellency should visit the French acting Agent and Consul General to convey the expression of his regrets for errors committed in the execution of the lawful decree of the Egyptian Government. With regard to the second Question asked by the noble Marquess, I have to slate that Her Majesty's Government, agreeing with the Government of Russia, that they desire to provide means for any 1472 settlement which may be needful, of differences between them arising out of the engagement at Ak Tepe, concur with thorn that they do not desire to see gallant officers on either side put upon their trial. For this purpose they are ready to refer to the judgment of the Sovereign of a friendly State any difference which may be found to exist in regard to the interpretation of the agreement between the two Cabinets of the 16th of March, with a view to the settlement of the matter in a manner consistent with the honour of both States. The two Governments trust that no difficulty will occur as to the details of the reference, and are prepared, tinder these circumstances, to resume at once in London the negotiations on the main points of the line, for the delimitation of the Frontier, the details of which only would be examined and traced on the spot under the conditions agreed on in the Commission. This negotiation, of which it is not possible at present to anticipate the result, will be much facilitated, as regards Her Majesty's Government, by the knowledge they now possess of the views of the Ameer and the full topographical information which has reached the India Office. It is further agreed that the district of Penjdeh shall be neutralized during the negotiations, and the Russian Government have intimated their willingness to consider the question of the Russian outposts being removed on the arrival of the Commissions.
§ THE MARQUESS OF SALISBURYI should like to ask the noble Earl a Question or two with regard to the statement he has made. First, when he states that the seizure of the offices of The Bosphore was illegal, does he mean illegal under any International instrument which would give the French Government aright, as against the Egyptian Government, to interfere—that is to say, under what are called the Capitulations; or, does he mean merely illegal under the existing decrees and laws of the Egyptian Government? And, secondly, I wish to know, whether the action of the Egyptian Government in closing The Bosphore was due to the initiative and suggestion of the Representative of Her Majesty's Government, or whether it was taken spontaneously? With respect to the announcement which the noble Earl has made as to the Afghan negotiations, I would ask him what is 1473 the meaning of the words "Provide means for any settlement which may be needful of the differences?" What is to be referred, and what will the result of the reference be—will it be the punishment of those who have misconducted themselves, or will it be simply an apology from one Government to another?
§ EARL GRANVILLEI made the statement with regard to The Bosphore as full as I could in order to give the general information to your Lordships' House. At the same time, I do not wish to go into very great detail on either of the points in question, inasmuch as the Papers which will soon be produced will give your Lordships a much fuller knowledge of the circumstances than I could in a statement in answer to Questions. With regard to one of the Questions of the noble Marquess, however, I have no difficulty in giving an answer. The illegality of the seizure of The Bosphore arose out of the rights of the French Government under the Capitulations with regard to the Press. As to the Afghan Question, we have agreed to refer to the judgment of a friendly Power the mode of arriving at a settlement closing the incident, and which shall be honourable to both Parties. I think the noble Marquess will and must see that it is impossible for me in this place to anticipate what the result of that judgment will be.
§ THE MARQUESS OF SALISBURYThen it is a general reference without any special indication of the limits within which the jurisdiction is to be exercised, and a general reference of all matters of difference that have arisen with regard to this Penjdeh incident? I would ask another Question, which arises out of the noble Earl's statement—and which I may observe is merely put for the purpose of elucidation. He stated that the Government would be much guided by their knowledge of the wishes of the Ameer with respect to his own Frontier. Were the Government entirely ignorant of the Ameer's wishes on this point before they began these negotiations—that is to say, until quite recently?
§ EARL GRANVILLEIt must be perfectly obvious to the noble Marquess that when there has been an interview of several days between the Viceroy of India and the Ameer we have not only 1474 more information, but information on which we can better rely, than that which we previously possessed. With regard to the reference to the judgment of a Sovereign of a friendly State, the text of that reference has not yet been absolutely decided upon; and I think it is quite clear that I had better adhere to the words I have already used, and not go further into details.
§ THE MARQUESS OF SALISBURYAre the Capitulations to which the noble Earl has referred to be printed along with the Papers?
§ EARL GRANVILLEThe Papers to be presented are under consideration, and I shall do my best to lay all information before the House.
LORD ELLENBOROUGHThe noble Earl stated that Russia had evacuated, or would consider the evacuation of, Penjdeh when the labours of the Commission commenced. What does he mean? Does he——
§ EARL GRANVILLENo; the noble Lord has quite misapprehended what I said. I said they had agreed to consider it. I really think that I cannot go further than the statement I have made.