MOTION FOR AN ADDRESS. (Hansard, 3 September 1880)

§ LORD WAVENEY,
in rising to move— That an humble Address be presented to Her Majesty, praying that negotiations be commenced in order to constitute Candahar with the dependent territory into a free city and emporium of commerce under British administration and government, said, that their Lordships would probably remember that the period when he first gave Notice of his Motion was signalized by the fact of a British force having met with a most serious disaster—one of those occurrences which human foresight could not always prevent; and, as a consequence, he was recommended by the noble Earl the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs (Earl Granville) to postpone it, on the ground that the time was inopportune for its consideration. That recommendation was shared in by his noble Friend (Viscount Cranbrook), and he (Lord Waveney) willingly gave way; but, in doing so, he must say he had not the least intention of abandoning it; and now, when he again desired to bring forward the Motion he had placed upon the Paper, time had brought about a very different state of things, as they had just had the good fortune to learn by telegram that the army of Ayoub Khan was dispersed, and that out of 30 guns composing part of its strength, no less than 27 were now in the possession of the British forces. Judging from that telegram, he thought it might be said that the disaster they deplored had been repaired, and the enemy was either now in retreat back to the place from which he started, or he might turn northward to Cabul, and develop the perturbed forces which were seething in Northern Afghanistan. However that might be, it was not his inten- 1175 tion to detain their Lordships with many observations either on the political or military position; hut he believed the events of this war were looked to by the people chiefly as a means of consolidating the Empire. What was their posiat the present moment? Year after year they had pursued a certain policy there; but he would only ask their Lordships to look at the last two years. They thought they would have been able to settle the question in one campaign; but a second and a third campaign had been necessary; and it was impossible, according to the policy adopted, to consolidate their rule. Their policy had been to have a strong, a friendly, and an united Afghanistan to serve as a bulwark against the confusions and intrigues of Western Asia. The question was, whether some more fixed and bettor system could not be discovered—whether some further security could not be obtained in return for the thousands of lives that had been lost and the millions of money expended owing to the disturbances among the hill tribes of Afghanistan. But there had been an order to separate Candahar from the rest of Afghanistan. Was that done for the purpose of obtaining greater security for lives and property in that country? He believed that by returning to the old paths of British statesmen, and consolidating our resources, India would be rendered secure for the future. If that were done in regard to Candahar, they would now secure opportunities for good which should not be sacrificed. They would take the opportunity of inaugurating a new and beneficent system external to our present territory, endeavouring to develop the national industry under favourable circumstances, and taking care that it was exercised under conditions which should secure the honour and dignity of the Empire. As to the political question, he might say that they found themselves, for a second time, in secure possession of Candahar, and he had framed his Motion with as much care as possible. The first point in it was, that there should be negotiations, although, after all the sacrifices we had incurred, and after the gratuitous and wanton attack which had been made upon ourselves, we should be justified by the law of arms and of empire in fixing our standard on the fortress of Candahar. 1176 He did not, however, wish to do that; but rather to enter into negotiations in order to make it a free city, a proceeding as to which he thought there could be no objection, seeing that that Prince would have been a wanderer on the face of the earth but for the British strength which supported him. He did not believe there had reverted to the Imperial Exchequer one single rupee as a recompense for the loss of all the British lives and blood which had been poured out like water. Surely it was time, in the interest of humanity, to discharge the duty we owed to India, and to see, once for all, that our Indian Empire was made secure, by constituting a strong frontier in the North-West of India, which should be under British administration. The opinion of all military men who knew the country well was that, whatever might become of Herat, Candahar could be retained in the British power. He was told it was capable of substantial defence at a very slight cost. He conceived that such territories might be assigned to it as would form a military zone within which peace, commerce, and equal laws would flourish under British administration. As to the opinions on this subject, he could quote from those of authorized representatives of public writers in India and in this country, and of commercial bodies like the great Chambers of Commerce whom he had had an opportunity of consulting, and who thought that what he now proposed was possible to be done. They would only have to make a railway of about 277 miles in length, and they would be able to convey bales of goods from Liverpool to Candahar at a comparatively small cost, and troops and arms from Woolwich might be placed in the country in from six to seven weeks. With British commerce and arms at Candahar, they would, in the course of time, bring about a very different state of things in Afghanistan. Candahar had in all ages been the key of India. As he heard it well remarked to-day, it had been the gate through which invasions had poured into that country; and it had been one of the principal routes of Asiatic commerce. It would be greatly for the advantage of commerce were Candahar placed under British administration; for by means of an improved communication with India, it might become a depot of exceeding value. He 1177 did not desire to establish a high-handed military despotism at Candahar, but to make that city a centre of commerce, under the protection of Great Britain. He could conceive nothing more advantageous for the distracted cities of Afghanistan than that Candahar should become a nucleus of civilization, which would undoubtedly spread around and bring with it peace and prosperity. On the other hand, if the course he proposed were not taken, they would probably leave the country a prey to all the evils of anarchy. He also considered that such territories might be added and placed under the protection of England as would secure the passes into India. He had put his Motion into the shape of a Motion for an Address to the Crown, as it was the most convenient form; but he had no wish to divide on it if it was understood that before any decisive step was taken the whole subject would receive the careful consideration of Her Majesty's Government. The noble Lord concluded by moving the Resolution of which he had given Notice.

LORD DENMAN
agreed with the noble Lord as to the importance of the subject. In his work, published at Paris in 1671, Bernier, who had been Physician at Aurungzebe, wrote— Apropos du Government de Kabul qui confronte avec le Royaume de Kandahar. Kandahar cette forte et importante place, qui est la capitale et la maitresse de ce beau et riche royaume de mesne nom. But, in the present state of the atmosphere, it was impossible to decide what arrangement could be made.

LORD LAWRENCE
said, it had been stated that we were wantonly attacked by the Afghans, but he could hardly conceive that such was the case. What he feared was that we had wantonly attacked them. He would remind their Lordships that it had been stated, over and over again, that Candahar was perfectly secure; but we had now been in occupation for over 18 months, and had every opportunity of concentrating our position, yet the position had not proved one of perfect security. The opinions of certain 1178 Chambers of Commerce had been referred to; but they had no proof that those Chambers of Commerce knew anything about India. If that which they were in favour of would extend commerce, their opinions were sufficiently accounted for, and they might have effect given to them without running any risk on their part.

§ THE EARL OF NORTHBROOK
said, that the time at which his noble Friend (Lord Waveney) brought forward his Motion was a highly inconvenient one. In the present condition of affairs in Southern Afghanistan, it appeared to him to be undesirable that any discussion should take place as to the steps which Her Majesty's Government might think necessary when those affairs were settled. He should be very ill representing Her Majesty's Government if he did not take that opportunity of expressing the great gratification which they had felt at the receipt of the telegram which had been read to the House that evening. The arrangements made by the Viceroy and the Government of India, the success of the march of Sir Frederick Roberts from Cabul to Candahar, showing, as it did, the endurance and discipline of the troops, both British and Native, and the successful action of which they had received the news that day, were circumstances which could not but give to every Englishman feelings of the liveliest satisfaction. And those feelings were still more gratifying because they pointed to some not very remote time at which the arrangement of the affairs of Afghanistan might be concluded. With respect to the Motion which his noble Friend had made, as he did not propose to take the sense of their Lordships' House upon it, he (the Earl of Northbrook) would venture to ask for indulgence if he abstained from entering into the arguments his noble Friend had advanced. He asked that indulgence for a reason which he thought their Lordships would appreciate, and that was that at that moment there was but one noble Lord (Lord Denman) representing the Benches opposite, and it would be impossible for him to discuss, with any degree of satisfaction to himself, a considerable portion of his noble Friend's speech without, perhaps, using expressions or making allusions from which he would prefer to abstain unless those who, in the late Government, were responsible 1179 for the conduct of affairs in India were present. He would only say, in reference to what fell from his noble Friend (Lord Lawrence), that he had almost always entirely agreed with the opinions expressed before their Lordships on the subject of the war in Afghanistan by his revered father the distinguished late Viceroy of India. He hoped their Lordships would not agree to the Motion of his noble Friend. His noble Friend who, and those with whom he was associated, had assumed the somewhat exclusive title of the Patriotic Association, had represented their opinions to the Secretary of State for India. He did not for a moment doubt the sentiments of patriotism which animated them, nor did he doubt they might have advanced some suggestions which were worthy of consideration; but he had always thought that the gentlemen who belonged to those associations might show with advantage a little more courage, and not be so much alarmed at possible future evils and dangers which they were always bringing before the public. He (the Earl of Northbrook) thought, on the contrary, that the British Empire in India was amply strong enough to protect itself against any attack. The lesson, moreover, which we ought to learn from what had taken place both in our own campaigns in Afghanistan and in the Russian campaigns in Turkestan, was, he thought, that many, at any rate of the apprehensions expressed by the Patriotic Association were not founded upon any real or substantial reason.

§ LORD WAVENEY,
in reply, said, he was not a member of the Patriotic Association, and he would remark that if the noble Earl (the Earl of Northbrook) had told them that associations were not to be formed for considering the improvement of the government of Afghanistan, the mist of Simla must have obscured the noble Earl's vision.