HL Deb 02 May 1876 vol 228 cc1949-53

Amendments reported (according to order.)

Clause 4 (Nomination of Commissioners).

On Motion of the Marquess of Salisbury the List of Commissioners was altered as follows:—

The Right Hon. Roundell, Baron Selborne; the Right Hon. John Thomas, Baron Redesdale; the Right Hon. Montague Barnard, Doctor of Civil Law; the Honourable Sir William Robert Grove, one of the Justices of Her Majesty's High Court of Justice; Sir Henry Sumner Maine, Doctor of Civil Law; the Reverend John William Burgon, Dean of Chichester; Matthew White Ridley, Esquire, Master of Arts.

Clause 16 (Objects of statutes for Colleges in themselves).

The Marquess of SALISBURY

said, that, in deference to the opinion of several Members of the Episcopal Bench, and of a very strong and unanimous expression of opinion from other quarters, he would propose an Amendment the effect of which would be to bring the Headships of the Colleges within the action of the Commissioners. But, as a security for the provision of religious instruction would be thereby impaired, he further proposed to insert words giving power to the Commissioners to make that provision.

The Provisoes in sub-sections 1 and 4 excepting the Headships from the powers given by this clause struck out.

THE MARQUESS OF SALISBURY moved, after sub-section (1.) to insert as a new sub-section— (2.) For determining the age after which the holder of a Fellowship not attached to any office in the College or in the University shall take part in the Government of the College. He thought that without some limitation in this respect the Commissioners would be reluctant to create any number of prize Fellowships.


hoped their Lordships would not accept the new sub-section. Amongst the other reasons he had for opposing it was that the noble Marquess took up in it again a position from which on the last occasion, he had retreated—a course never before adopted in their Lordships' House with regard to Amendments. Then as to fixing the age After which the holder of a Fellowship not attached to any office in the College or in the University shall take part in the Government of the College, it must be some age beyond 21, as no student ever attained a Fellowship before that age. But the noble and learned Lord on the Woolsack, last year, in discussing the law of Scotch entails, under which an heir could not get rid of his expectancy until 25, pointed out that there was no other instance in which a man was not considered of age at 21 for all purposes whatever. This sub-section, on the contrary, would establish as a law a new state of things, so that while the most foolish young man was considered legally able to conduct his affairs at 21 the most able young man should not be deemed able to take part in the government of his College till he was 25—if that should be the limit of age fixed upon. Everyone knew that the attainment of a power to share in the government of his College was a chief incentive of every student. He most sincerely hoped their Lordships would not impose this restriction on the young men of our Universities, and that they would decline to accept this Amendment.


regretted that he could not support the sub-section. He considered that the difficulty was created by the proposal to shorten the tenure of Fellowships. If a Fellowship was held for less than 10 years, and the Fellow was not a member of the Governing Body for the first two years, the very evil referred to—that of continual changes in the Governing Body—would be aggravated.


said, that this was a matter of such importance that the House ought to have more time to consider it, and he appealed to the noble Marquess to at least postpone its further consideration till the third reading.


consented to postpone the consideration of his Amendment.

Amendment, by leave of the House, withdrawn.

THE EARL OF MORLEY moved to insert, after Clause 17, a new clause— The Commissioners shall have power, with the consent of two-thirds of the Governing Body of Oriel College, to make a severance from the provost ship of the said College of the canonry of Rochester thereto annexed; they may also sever from the said provostship any ecclesiastical benefice annexed thereto, and assign such portion (if any) of the income of the benefice as they, with the consent of the Ecclesiastical Commissioners, may determine, to be paid out of the revenues of the benefice to the Provost of Oriel for the time being.


opposed the Motion, on the ground that the object which it sought to effect was outside this Bill.

Clause, by leave of the House, withdrawn.

THE MARQUESS OF SALISBURY moved, after Clause 19, to insert new clauses—

(Provision for accounts, audit, &c.)

"The Commissioners, in statutes made by them, shall make provision—

"(1.) For the form of accounts of the University and of a College and Hall, relating to funds administered either for general purposes or in trust, and for the audit thereof;

"(2.) For the publication of accounts of receipts and expenditure of money raised under the borrowing powers of the University or of a College or Hall."

He proposed the new clause to meet suggestions thrown out on a former occasion by the noble Duke (the Duke of Cleveland). There was a jealousy on the part of the Colleges of the proposition to submit their accounts annually, and he did not think there was any necessity for calling on them to do so.


said, the clause would fully meet his views. He never had intended to interfere with the ordinary expenditure of the Colleges, which he believed to be very fairly administered.

Clause agreed to, and inserted in the Bill.

THE MARQUESS OF SALISBURY moved to insert, after Clause 19, a new clause— (Union of Colleges and Halls.) The Commissioners, in statutes made by them, may make provision for the complete or partial union of two or more Colleges, or of a College and a Hall, provided application in that behalf is made to the Commissioners on the part of the Colleges or College and Hall, in the case of a College by resolution passed at a general meeting of the College specially summoned for this purpose by the votes of not less than two-thirds of the number of persons present and voting, with the consent in writing of the Visitor of the College; and in the case of a Hall by a resolution of the Hebdomadal Council, with the consent in writing of the Visitor and Principal of the Hall.

Clause agreed to, and inserted in the Bill.

THE EARL OF CAMPERDOWN moved, in Clause 28, page8, leave out paragraph, line 33 to line 3 in page 9 inclusive, and insert as new paragraph— The Commissioners shall take into consideration any representation made to them by the Governing Body of the school or by the Charity Commissioners respecting the proposed statute.


objected to the Amendment on the ground that it would extend the purview of the Bill in the case of schools.

Amendment, by leave of the House, withdrawn.

THE MARQUESS OF SALISBURY moved to insert, at end of Clause 37— (Disallowance by Order in Council.) If the Universities Committee report their opinion that a statute referred to them ought to be remitted to the Commissioners with a declaration, it shall be lawful for the Queen in Council to remit the same accordingly; and the Commissioners shall reconsider the statute, with the declaration, and the statute, if and as modified by the Commissioners, shall be preceded on as an original statute is proceded on, and so from time to time.

Amendment agreed to, and added to the Clause.

Further Amendments made; and Bill to be read 3a on Thursday next; and to be printed, as amended. (No. 68.)