§ THE EARL OF HARROWBY,in moving an Address to Her Majesty for Copy of a Petition recently presented to Convocation in reference to the training and licensing of a body of Confessors in the Church of England, said, their Lordships were aware that a few weeks ago a Petition was presented by the Archbishop of Canterbury to the Upper House of Convocation of that Province, signed by a considerable body of clergy- 1167 men, praying for the training and licensing a body of Confessors within the Church. He had no wish to take up the time of their Lordships by any discussion on the subject of the Confessional. Convocation, however, was a most important body as regarded the Church, and being so it was of the utmost importance that it should possess the confidence of the laity. Now, there could be no doubt that the petitioners made a very startling proposal. He was aware that several clergymen had individually advocated confession, but they had done so on their own responsibility; but this was the first time since the Reformation, that a proposal had been made to give it the authorization of the Church itself, and it was of the utmost importance to know how it had been received by Convocation. As far as he could learn, the Bishops received the Memorial, and had offered no reply to it; but, at the same time, they had thought it right to take that opportunity of expressing their opinion upon the main subject raised by the Memorial. The consequence was that a Committee was appointed, and a very valuable Report was presented by them to Convocation. That there might be no misconception on the subject, and that the public might know not only the nature of the Petition, and the number and importance of the signatures, but also what was the reply of the Bishops, he thought it right that the transaction should in a formal way be laid before Parliament. He, therefore, begged to move the Address of which he had given Notice.
Moved, that an humble Address be presented to Her Majesty for, Copy of petition presented to the Upper House of Convocation of the Province of Canterbury by the Archbishop of Canterbury, praying among other things for the training and licensing of a body of confessors in the Church of England; together with the names of the subscribers and copy of the answer to the same presented by the Committee of the whole Upper House.—(The Earl of Harrowby.)
THE BISHOP OF LONDON,in the absence of the Archbishop of Canterbury, said, there would be no objection to lay a Copy of the Petition on the Table of the House. With respect to the Report referred to by the noble Earl, he wished it to be understood that it was in no way an answer to the Petition. A Committee of Convocation was appointed to consider the subject and draw up a 1168 Report on it. That Report had been drawn up and presented, but had not yet been adopted. Strictly speaking, therefore, the matter was still under consideration; and the document asked for being thus incomplete, he thought it was, at least, premature to ask for its production.
LORD HOUGHTONhoped the noble Earl (the Earl of Harrowby) would not press his Motion. It would be a great error for their Lordships to interfere with Convocation—if they did they might in time find themselves drawn into the arena of theological controversy—a thing which was to be avoided as much as possible. He thought it was a pity that the noble Earl had brought forward the Motion in the absence of the Archbishops, who might have given some explanation which might have proved useful. Moreover, they had heard, too, from the right rev. Prelate, that the action of Convocation in the matter was as yet inchoate and incomplete, and had not yet assumed a character which would warrant their Lordships in adopting the course recommended. There was another objection to the Motion of the noble Earl. Matters of a transitory character like the one involved in the Petition, in connection with which there was necessarily a good deal of excitement, ought not to have their importance too much magnified. That, he was afraid, had been too much done in the case under discussion. He was told that a very considerable number of those who had subscribed to it had done so hastily, without comprehending its real import, and possibly under some confusion of ideas as to the real principle involved. For these reasons he thought the Petition in question ought not to be made the subject of an Address to the Crown. By adopting the course advised by the noble Earl, they would simply be giving permanent importance to a document which in itself was transitory and of small moment in its character. Above all, they would arouse a large amount of public animosity against many gentlemen who had, as he had explained, signed the Petition unwittingly.
THE BISHOP OF GLOUCESTER AND BRISTOLventured to think that some inconvenience would result from giving publicity to the names of those who had signed the Memorial. Many of those 1169 gentlemen had appended their names without serious thought; and it had transpired that several had withdrawn their signatures, and not a few had even expressed regret for having signed the Petition under the impression that it was something else. Under these circumstances he hoped, at all events, that the noble Earl would withdraw that portion of his Motion which asked for the production of the names of the subscribers.
EARL NELSONsaid, their Lordships could scarcely ask Convocation to lay before them a document which was imperfect and incomplete in its character. When both Houses of Convocation had definitely given their decision upon it, the Motion of the noble Earl might be moved with perfect propriety; but at present it was premature. He thought it most undesirable to publish the names of the signers—it might hurt the prospects of many young men who had signed the Petition somewhat hastily.
§ THE MARQUESS OF SALISBURYalso strongly urged his noble Friend to leave out that portion of his Motion relating to the names of the subscribers.
THE LORD CHANCELLOR'Sopinion was that it would be as irregular to ask for the production of the Petition while it was still under the consideration of Convocation as it would be for the House of Commons to ask for a Report of one of its Select Committees before it was laid on the Table; he did not at all see how they could ask for the Report of the Committee until Convocation had adopted it. He strongly objected to the production of the names of those who had signed the Petition—especially as it appeared that a large proportion of them were not aware of the precise nature of the document they were signing. He could not but take notice of the evidence which this and other late instances afforded of the mischievous effects of the practice of hawking Petitions about the country in order to obtain promiscuous signatures. Nothing was to his mind more objectionable or reprehensible, whoever were the parties who did it, or whatsoever might be their objects. One result of the practice was, that they found people coming forward one after another confessing that when they appended their names to a document, purporting to be a serious expression of opinion upon subjects of 1170 the gravest importance, they really did not know what they were signing. He was afraid that this was too often the case in respect to Petitions presented to both Houses of Parliament.
THE BISHOP OF CHICHESTERhoped the noble Earl would withdraw his Motion, because the carrying of it might embitter the controversy.
§ LORD HATHERLEYwished to ask the noble Earl whether it was worth his while to press his Motion? The Petition itself was of very grave importance, but not of such importance as to require an Address to the Crown that a Copy of it might he presented to their Lordships. Their Lordships had been told that a number of those who signed the Petition had signed it in ignorance of its contents, and that others had signed it under a total misapprehension of the subject. He remembered the case of a Petition which was presented on behalf of a woman who had attempted to murder both her father and mother. The Petition stated that if her life were spared she might be useful as a teacher in a school in one of the Colonies. He must join his humble request to that of the noble Lord below him, that the noble Earl, for the present at least, would not press his Motion.
§ THE EARL OF HARROWBYsaid, it did not require the intercession of so many Members of the Ecclesiastical Bench and of their Lordships generally to induce him to yield at once to the appeal made to him. It would certainly be better that the answer of the Committee of Convocation should not be placed before Parliament before it had been formally accepted by the whole body. As to the condemnation passed by the noble and learned Lord on the Woolsack on the practice of hawking about Petitions for promiscuous signature, he quite agreed with the noble and learned Lord. As for this particular case he should not have attached such importance to the isolated action of a few eccentric clergymen, if it had been such; but the fact was that the Petition in question was the work of an organized body, which had divided all England into districts for the purpose of extending the practice of auricular confession. Their zeal and their organization were unbounded. He had seen a circular specially addressed to children, marked "the eighth thousand," urging them 1171 to go to a priest at the earliest moment for the purpose of confessing their sins to him. It was most important that some corrective of this abuse should be set up, and he trusted the Bishops would promulgate their opinion at the earliest moment possible.
§ Motion (by leave of the House) withdrawn.