SECOND READING. (Hansard, 3 May 1872)

THE DUKE OF ST. ALBANS
, in moving that the Bill be now read the second time, said, that the Bill was originally introduced in the other House, but, owing to the pressure of Business and a rule that no Opposed Business should be taken after half-past 12 o'clock, had been transferred to this House. By an Act of last Session Commissioners were appointed to prepare a scheme for the preservation of Epping Forest, and to inquire into forest lands unlawfully inclosed. It was objected during the progress of the measure that private rights were not sufficiently guarded by it; but this was owing to the absence of the notices requisite in the case of Private Bills, and an undertaking was given that 190 the subject should be dealt with this year. The Bill was a redemption of that pledge, and though in form a Public, it was rather a Private one. The Select Committee to which he hoped it would be referred would have power not only over its clauses, but over its principle, and would be able to hear all parties concerned. The Metropolitan Board of Works had undertaken to carry out the projected scheme, and the Government had no interest in the matter, except that the question should be fully considered and all parties heard. It was unnecessary, therefore, for him to offer any opinion on the claims of the persons holding land in the Forest.

§ THE MARQUESS OF SALISBURY
said, he was rather disappointed with the noble Duke's statement, for the undertaking on which he had waived his opposition to the second reading, and which accounted for the thin state of the House, was that the character of the Bill should be entirely altered. At present it was most violent and unconstitutional, for it proposed to refer the disputes between the Crown, a number of landowners, and the Corporation of London now pending in courts of law and equity to arbitrators, consisting of three laymen and a lawyer who had never sat on the Bench. There was to be no appeal from their decision. Now, of late years similar powers had been given to arbitrators, but always to men of high position and experience—indeed, he believed exclusively to ex-Chancellors. He had felt it his duty to resist such a proposal as worse even than the recent proposition of the noble and learned Lord on the Woolsack to refer the appeals of this House to barristers of 10 years' standing. It was, moreover, unexampled to refer suits of the Crown to persons appointed by the Crown and subject to dismissal by it at any moment. The undertaking given him was on the understanding that the Bill should simply suspend all these suits and actions until the Commissioners had reported and Parliament could deal more fully with the subject, and it was on this ground only that he had not persevered in the opposition he originally offered to the Bill. He hoped the Government would adhere to the arrangement for striking out all the other powers.

THE EARL OF KIMBERLEY
disclaimed any intention of departing from the understanding alluded to by the noble Marquess. After being read the second time, it was intended that the Bill should follow the usual course of a Private Bill and should be referred to a Select Committee, and that it should be confined to suspensory clauses, pending an opportunity on the part of Parliament to deal definitely with the question.

§ LORD REDESDALE
maintained that the Bill in its present shape should never have been introduced. Time would be saved and, perhaps, opposition removed by its withdrawal and its introduction in the shape it was intended to retain, and in that shape submitted to the Committee.

THE EARL OF KIMBERLEY
remarked that all the notices involved in the Bill in its present shape had been issued. The Government were willing to meet the objections which had been taken, and the second reading would not hinder its taking the form now agreed on by all parties. To withdraw it would involve delay, and great hardship and inconvenience would result if no Bill was passed.

§ THE MARQUESS OF SALISBURY
said, he was quite satisfied with the pledge given by the noble Earl, but would suggest, as more convenient, that the Bill should be committed pro formâ and referred to the Select Committee in the shape agreed upon.

§ LORD REDESDALE
said, he did not object to this suggestion, but thought that as the same objections were taken in the other House, the Government might have remodelled the Bill before introducing it here.

THE EARL OF KIMBERLEY
agreed to adopt the suggestion of the noble Marquess, and that the Bill should be committed pro formâ and reprinted.