MOTION FOR, PAPERS. (Hansard, 4 March 1872)

THE MARQUESS OF CLANRICARDE
rose to move for copies of the Instructions under which Captain Tyler had been authorised to collect information respecting the financial condition and prospects of the Irish Railways, and of the reports or other communications made by that officer thereupon. The subject to which those Instructions referred was one of great importance to Ireland; it had been often dealt with by the public journals, and had been brought directly under the cognizance of the Members of the Government. He had himself, in 1867, formed one of a deputation of noblemen and gentlemen who had waited upon the Government on the subject. The question, therefore, was not a new one. The purchase of railways in England had been considered by a Royal Commission; but the conclusions at which the majority of that Commission had arrived were not applicable to Irish railways, which required to be considered with reference to the wants of the country, and not with reference to the interests of the companies. There were in Ireland no fewer than 66 railway companies, and 24 actually working: and those who were best informed as to the necessities of Ireland had demonstrated to the Government that under the existing system the people of that country could not possibly obtain the railway accommodation they required. Railways could not be maintained in Ireland without greater economy than was necessary in Great Britain. In Ireland, during recent years, they had suffered from many of the ills which had been mentioned as likely to follow from the carrying out of a scheme of railway amalgamation now before Parliament. He might mention that in that part of Ireland with which he was connected two large companies, who had been previously in opposition, had subsequently combined, and, having everything now in their own hands, were able to charge whatever fares, and give only what accommodation, they pleased. Thus the people had suffered, in the first instance, the evils of competition, such as they were, and then subsequently the evils, not of amalgamation, but of combination. And yet 1297 no interference took place. Considering the mileage of the Irish railroads, and the amount of capital invested in them, as compared with the mileage and the capital of the London and North-Western Company, or a smaller class of English companies, it was ridiculous to have such a number of Boards as were now at the head of the various Irish lines. Until there was united management, there never could be the necessary economy. He had reports of several of the last half-yearly meetings of Irish railways, and he found that the chairmen announced that Captain Tyler had been making inquiries of them as to the price which the shareholders would take for their property. It could not be supposed that Captain Tyler would have made such inquiries without direct instructions from the Government, nor could it be imagined that, having made them, he would not draw up a Report for the information of the Government, or make no communication to the Board of Trade, or any other Department. In reply to a Question put in "another place," the President of the Board of Trade was reported to have stated that there was no Report from Captain Tyler. Of course, if his right hon. Friend had made such a statement he believed it; but it might have been that the Report was not prepared at the time the Question was asked. He therefore put his Question now, and hoped he would receive a more satisfactory answer.

THE EARL OF DUFFERIN
said, he had to state, in reply to the noble Marquess, that it was impossible to comply with his request, for the simple reason that no such instructions were given to Captain Tyler in the terms of his noble Friend's Motion. Captain Tyler had been sent to Ireland to inquire into a matter totally different from the Irish railways; but he had been permitted, rather than authorized, to enter into communication with various persons interested in the arrangements of the Irish railways, in order to learn what their 1298 opinion might be as to the terms on which those railways might be bought. But he had not been authorized, nor had he entered into any inquiry either as to the financial prospects or the financial status of the Irish railways. Captain Tyler had made no Reports to Her Majesty's Government, and, therefore, it was simply impossible to comply with the Motion of the noble Marquess.

THE MARQUESS OF CLANRICARDE
stated that, in consequence of what had fallen from the noble Earl, he would not, of course, press his Motion; but he gave his noble Friend notice that he would bring the subject before their Lordships within a short time. He had the statements of four Chairmen of railways in Ireland to the effect that they were asked what their shareholders would take, and they distinctly stated that Captain Tyler told them he was not instructed to make any offer on the part of the Government, but that he was authorized by the Government to ask for information! and information he did ask for, as to the value which the shareholders put upon their property.