COMMITTEE. (Hansard, 1 July 1870)

§ LORD CAIRNS

said, that in consequence of the legislation of last year with reference to the Irish Church, the Government had made a promise of proposing legislation on the subject of the Ecclesiastical Titles Act. He admitted that, as the Irish Church had ceased to be an Established Church, it was absolutely necessary that something should be done in this matter; but, if it had not been for the Act of last year, it would have been better to leave the Ecclesiastical Titles Act alone. As, however, it was necessary to do something, he did not object to its being done. But he had a proposition to make in connection with the Bill which he hoped their Lordships would not think an unreasonable one. If they were to repeal the whole of the Ecclesiastical Titles Act, without carefully explaining that the declaration contained in it, either inferentially or positively, as to the state of the common and general law of England were not meant to be departed from, they might give rise to serious misapprehension out-of-doors, where it might be thought that Parliament had changed its mind with regard to the truth and propriety of those declarations. In repealing the Penalty Clauses of the Ecclesiastical Titles Act, therefore, they ought to be very cautious not to fall into that danger, and to show on the face of their legislation that the declaration which accompanied those penalties in that Act were well founded and still continued in full force. He wished to preserve all that was valuable in the substance of the declaration embodied in that Act, and while removing penalties imposed on the use of ecclesiastical titles which were intended merely as titles of office, and not as titles of authority, honour, or dignity, still to maintain the established law of this country, which was to the effect that all titles of dignity, honour, and authority flowed from the Sovereign alone, and that it was not in the power of any person other than the Sovereign of these realms to confer such titles.

THE EARL OF KIMBERLEY

said, that the object of the Government, in preparing the Bill, was precisely in accordance with what had just been stated by the noble and learned Lord opposite; and he did not think they should have any occasion to quarrel about the words used for carrying out that object. In repealing the penalties of the Ecclesiastical Titles Act they ought not to invalidate the declarations made in that Act, as to the law of the land at the time when it was passed: he should, however, feel some reluctance in consenting to the re-enactment of those declarations in a somewhat stronger form than the necessity of the case perhaps required, and he should prefer the form in which it was done in the Bill. He was, however, content to accept the words of the Amendment proposed by the noble and learned Lord in the Preamble, but not those he proposed to insert in the enacting part of the Bill. Instead of the word "unlawful" in the first clause, as proposed by the noble and learned Lord, he thought it would be better to substitute 1302 "invalid, void, and of no effect to all intents and purposes."

The Preamble was then amended by inserting instead of "unlawful and void" the words "invalid, void, and of no effect" and agreed to.

Then the Clauses 1 and 2 struck out, and clauses as proposed by the Lord Cairns amended and agreed to:— 1. That no ecclesiastical title of honour or dignity derived from any see, province, diocese, or deanery, or from any city, place, or territory within this realm, can be validly created, assumed, or used, nor can any see, province, diocese, or deanery be created, nor can any coercive power or pre-eminence be conferred in respect thereto, otherwise than under the authority and by the favour of Her Majesty, her heirs and successors, and according to the laws of this realm; and any title of honour or dignity derived from any see, province, diocese, or deanery, or from any city, place, or territory within this realm attempted to be created, assumed, or used; and any see, province, diocese, or deanery attempted to be created, and any coercive power or pre-eminence in reference thereto attempted to be conferred by or under colour of any alleged authority out of this realm or any alleged authority within this realm, not being the authority of Her Majesty, her heirs and successors, and of the laws of this realm, is and ought to be taken to be unlawful and void. 2. That the said Act of the Session of Parliament held in the 14th and 15th years of the reign of Her Majesty, cap. 60, shall be and the same is hereby repealed. The Report of the Amendments to be received on Monday next: and Bill to be printed, as amended. (No. 175.)