§ LORD LYNDHURSTI wish to ask the noble Duke opposite (the Duke of Somerset) a question. But before I do so your Lordships will perhaps allow me to make a few observations on a matter personal to myself. My Lords, I am informed that an hon. Member, supported and backed up by a noble Lord, in another locality, if I may so express myself, has made certain charges against me with re- 347 forence to what fell from me the other night in the course of the discussion upon the defences of the country. One of those charges is undoubtedly true. The hon. Member stated that I was an "old man," or an "aged man," or an "old Peer," for there are varied readings of this classical attack. I am sorry to say that I am compelled to plead guilty to this part of the charge; while at the same time I cannot but admire the sarcasm so pointed, so keen, so bitter, so creditable to the taste and talent of the hon. Gentleman who made this extraordinary discovery. So much for this part of the charge. Another more serious part of the charge was to this effect—that the doctrines I laid down were not doctrines at all suited to the present day, and to the present enlightened state of society; that they were referable to a period of, I think, sixty years back, or some such period. But, my Lords, this part of the charge, I must bring to your recollection, is perfectly unfounded, and, if I may venture to say so, perfectly untrue. For what was the course of observation that I pursued? It was the most simple course that any man could have adopted. I reminded your Lordships that hitherto we had been in a state of perfect security at home and abroad with respect to our honour and interests, in consequence of the superiority of our navy. That was my statement. I went on to say that naval warfare had assumed a new shape, and a shape of such a character that it was impossible for us to say with confidence that we could rely upon such a state of security. And I called upon your Lordships and upon the Government to do everything in their power to put the country, both in its military and naval defences, in such a state as would restore us to the security that we have hitherto enjoyed. I entered, perhaps, too much into detail, but I never deviated for one moment from that line of argument. I do not believe that there is a conscientious man in this country, except the individual to whom I have referred, and who made this charge against me, who would differ from the opinion I then stated. I do not believe that any man who has the heart of an Englishman would have dissented from that statement. My Lords, it is very well for Englishmen in private life, when they are smitten upon one cheek, to turn the other cheek to the smiter. But that is not my feeling, and least of all ought it to be the feeling of a great and powerful nation. My Lords, 348 I might cite a passage from an eminent orator—an Athenian orator—which I think somewhat in point. He says in substance, "Nations build large fortresses, and lay out great sums of money for that purpose; but there is one common bulwark which every prudent man will take care to maintain. It is the great security of all nations, particularly of free States, against foreign despotic power." He goes on to ask, "What is this?" The answer he gives is, "Distrust, distrust. Be mindful of that, adhere to it, and you will be free from almost every calamity." I thought it right—perhaps necessary—to give this explanation, as to the substance of what I stated the other night in contradiction of those unfounded charges which have been preferred against me in the locality to which I refer. The question I have to put to the noble Duke is this— I am sure the noble Duke will not think it requires any previous notice, whether he is aware that the French are arming their fleet on the other side of the Channel with rifled cannon? I put this question because from the reports I have heard it would appear that the rifled cannon we are pie-paring will not extend to above 100 in the present year and 200 in the following year, whereas it is said the French rifled cannon are manufactured with such rapidity that they will be able to arm their fleet in that mode long before we can make use, to any extent, of the rifled cannon of Sir William Armstrong.
§ THE DUKE OF SOMERSETThe noble and learned Lord, in referring to what he said on a former evening, I must say, has entered into an explanation which does not agree with the impression made on my mind as to what he said on that occasion. I thought at the time that the observations of the noble and learned Lord were very pointed, and that he made many remarks that were unnecessarily offensive to other nations. I think the noble and learned Lord might have offered his advice—which is always received from him as from very high authority—without mixing it up with observations unnecessarily offensive to the feelings of a susceptible nation. That was the objection which I made at the time to the remarks of the noble and learned Lord. With regard to the question put by the noble and learned Lord, I have only to say that of course I have heard the report alluded to, though I cannot say that it was furnished upon any very authentic information. That report is that some rifled can- 349 non are being prepared in the French arsenals. I am aware, also, although we have many improvements in our cannon now in progress of manufacture, that the guns we are making, according to the most approved system, will not be ready for many months to come. But that is not the only question of importance. There are many other questions connected with the subject, but which I do not think it necessary to detain your Lordships by now entering upon. I do not think fit that I should now enter into all the questions connected with the improvements of cannon which are under the consideration of those Departments to which they belong. I must, therefore, decline to follow the noble and learned Lord into the discussion he has raised, for the purpose of showing what we have done in answer to what he stated he was informed the French had done.
§ LORD LYNDHURSTI think the observations made by the noble Duke are very unfounded. I put this question at the time: I said that persons will ask me, perhaps, whether I do not place confidence in the promises and assurances of the Emperor of the French. I said, I leave every man to answer that question as he thinks advisable. As for myself I answer it in this way. I will not trust the liberties of this country, its honour and its interests, to any declaration or promise of any friendly Power, or indeed of any Power whatsoever. I will rely solely upon my own power, my own resources, my own vigour, and the strength of my own right arm. I will not rely particularly upon the Emperor of the French, because from his situation I think that the Emperor cannot rely upon himself. These are the only observations, as I am aware, that fell from me in the recent debate in reference to the Emperor of the French. I appeal to your Lordships whether there is anything that any one can reasonably complain of in the observations I made.