§ Amendment reported, according to order.
THE LORD CHANCELLORsaid, it had been suggested in Committee that an Amendment should be made to enable persons who had filled the office of Lord Chancellor to be appointed Deputy Speakers under this Act, although they had not held judicial appointments for five years.
§ LORD REDESDALEobjected to the Amendment. He thought it was important for the House to retain the services of the independent law Lords who now attended the hearing of the appeals. The new Deputy Speakers were intended to assist them, and supply their unavoidable 951 absence, and not as a substitute for them.
§ The Amendment agreed to.
THE EARL OF MINTOobjected to certain portions of the 6th clause, on the ground that they were calculated to limit unduly the prerogative of the Crown, moved a series of verbal amendments with the view of obviating his objections; and to add the following new proviso:—
Provided always that nothing herein contained shall be construed as restricting or otherwise affecting the exercise of the Royal Prerogative, such as it existed prior to the passing of this Act.
§ EARL GRANVILLEdid not believe that the House of Lords had a right by itself, or by any mere Resolution of its; own, to decide the question of prerogative. Nevertheless, practically the House did decide it, because if their Lordships resolved not to admit a life Peer, a life Peer could not be forced upon the House. Such being the anomalous state of affairs, it appeared to him that the best thing to be done was for the three powers of the realm to come to a unanimous decision as to what the practice should be for the future. It could not be denied that the Crown had abandoned a portion of its prerogative in consenting to the introduction of the present Bill. At the same time the House had made a great concession, after declaring that life Peerages were unconstitutional, in admitting that a limited number should sit in that House. Such a mutual arrangement having been arrived at it would be undesirable to disturb it.
LORD CAMPBELLexpressed his satisfaction at what had just fallen from the President of the Council, and observed that it was no more than he had expected from the high an honourable character of the noble Earl.
THE EARL OF WICKLOWsaid, that there were many things which astonished him with regard to this Bill. He had heard, for example, that a compromise had been entered into in regard to it; but by whom, he asked, had that compromise been made? for certainly that House had never entered into any compromise. The effect of the Bill would be to cut down and impair the prerogative of the Crown. The noble Marquess, who was not now present (the Marquess of Lansdowne), had stated on a previous evening that no consideration should induce him to support this Bill if in any manner it infringed the prerogative of the 952 Crown. The noble and learned Lord on the woolsack had stated upon the same occasion that it would In no way affect the prerogative; but now they were told by the noble Earl the President of the Council that it was intended to limit the prerogative of the Crown. It appeared, therefore, that they were now about to pass a Bill which, though intended, no doubt, for a good and important purpose, contained provisions of great stringency, as to the effect of which different members of the Government held views utterly at variance with one another. He reminded their Lordships that they were about to launch this Bill on the stormy sea of the House of Commons; and it behoved them thoroughly to understand its nature and purport before sending it down to that House. He trusted that the noble Earl would persevere in the Amendments which he had proposed.
THE LORD CHANCELLORsaid, the arguments of others had been imputed to him as his own in the course of the debates upon that subject. It would be recollected that a proviso had been proposed that nothing should be introduced into the Bill that would affect the prerogative of the Crown. It was then said by certain noble Lords that if there was no prerogative upon that point, the proviso would not affect it. But he (the Lord Chancellor) had never said there was no prerogative; on the contrary, he believed there was until that Bill should have passed. He could not say, therefore, that the proviso would be useless; but he thought that fair dealing required that the Bill should pass in its present form.
LORD DENMANsaid, he must remark that noble Lords spoke of law peerages as if they were to be obtained by lawyers as easily as blackberries from every hedge; but even the late Lord Tenterden was nine years Lord Chief Justice of England before he was made a Peer, and he did not believe that his opinions were less regarded in their Lordships' House during those nine years than in the five subsequent years, in which he was a Peer. With regard to Lord Wensleydale's title, he hoped it would be fully understood that it was the reward for past services and not a gage for future exertions. With regard to his father, he knew how highly he valued the honour of a peerage, and the magnanimity of the Monarch who conferred it upon him, and he should be 953 happy at once to show the correspondence upon the subject to any noble Lord interested in it, though not to read it for general publication at present. His father had considered it the greatest honour which it was in the power of the Crown to bestow. With regard to the present measure, he was so convinced that it would satisfy no one, that he would move it be next considered or read a third time that day three months.
LORD DENMANsaid, he would move on the debate, as to the third reading—that it be read a third time that day three months and divide the House upon it.
§ Amendment withdrawn.
§ Bill to be read 3a To-morrow.