HL Deb 03 May 1855 vol 138 cc14-7

LORD STANLEY OF ALDERLEY moved the second reading of the Loan (16,000,000l.) Bill, and gave notice of his intention to move the suspension of the Standing Orders, so as to pass it through its remaining stages on the morrow.

LORD MONTEAGLE

knew the necessity of not impeding the passing of such a measure, but there were some portions of the Bill which called for remark, and he hoped that an opportunity would be afforded on the morrow to have a discussion on it.

LORD RAVENSWORTH

said, that he must ask for the usual indulgence of their Lordships in rising to address them for the first time. He could not avoid, on this Bill being presented to the House, expressing his concern at the circumstances which had arisen which rendered the presentation and acceptance of the Bill before their Lordships almost imperative—he alluded to the failure of the negotiations at Vienna—which he and the country considered as the evidence of an indefinite prolongation of the war. He had hoped, as it was the evident interest of all parties, that some arrangement might have been entered into for the pacification of Europe, and he could not now avoid expressing his great concern that this expectation had been disappointed. As it was, however, with war in, prospect, it had become our duty to direct our attention to the means of carrying it on with vigour. He found that two burdens of no inconsiderable extent were to be entailed upon the country, and of these the present Bill for raising by loan 16,000,000l. formed an important item. The Estimates for the present year for carrying on the navy amounted to more than 16,000,000l.; almost an equal sum was required for the army; the Ordnance Estimates were between 7,000,000l. and 8,000,000l., while 3,000,000l. more were devoted to other military purposes; the expenditure in the whole amounting to 44,000,000l. The present Loan Bill had passed the ordeal in another place, which might be considered more directly the guardian of the public expenditure, and it might perhaps be thought presumptuous in him to offer any remarks on it. He did not, however, intend to offer any direct opposition to the Bill, but at the same time he must say that it was of a nature to excite some discussion and criticism. Out of doors it was asked by those who were engaged in the trade and commerce of the country, why had not the Chancellor of the Exchequer come into the money market for the full amount required—that was, for some 20,000,000l. or 21,000,000l. of deficiency—instead of coupling the loan with other devices, and laying on additional taxes direct and indirect. He did not go the full length with those who would have the whole raised by loan, but he went so far as to think that this additional taxation was an earnest of the apprehension of the Government that the war would be indefinitely prolonged. If there had been any reason for believing that the war would have ceased in six or twelve months, then he should have concurred with those who considered it unwise to resort to this mode of indirect taxation by levying additional duty on articles which entered so largely into the consumption of the working classes, and which would tend to disturb those fiscal arrangements which had been made with the general consent of the people. If, on the other hand, there was reason—and he feared that there was too much—to apprehend that war would be prolonged much beyond twelve months, then he agreed with the policy which included articles of general consumption in the means for raising the required amount to carry on the war, as it was necessary, in such case, to attempt to restore to some extent the indirect taxation which had been too hastily abandoned. If, therefore, they were to regard the proposition of the Government as an indication that the war would not be concluded within a short time, he was willing to agree to their proposal. Such he knew were the feelings of the mercantile classes, and he did not hesitate to give his sanction to and express his opinion upon them. He must confess that the prospects before us were somewhat disheartening, and express the concern of this country and of the whole of Europe that the negotiations for peace had been brought to a close; and he only hoped that those mistakes which had arisen in carrying on the war on the part of the Government, and the profuse expenditure of the public money without adequate results, would also be brought to a close. He considered that up to this moment Her Majesty's Government had not taken all the steps which they might have taken, and ought to have taken, towards bringing the war to a successful termination. He could not help reverting to this time last year, when, in the Estimates brought before their Lordships, the expense of carrying troops as far as Malta was contemplated, and, at the same time, the expense of the return of those troops was also estimated. He could not help recollecting that the noble Lord, one of the most distinguished Members of Her Majesty's Government, in another place, whom he could only describe as the unsuccessful negotiator of the interests of this country at Vienna, seemed last year to entertain a trifling opinion of the war in which they were about to engage, and declared that it was so far from being an objection to the reform measure which he introduced that he considered it rather favourable, at the same time that they were entering upon a war with the most colossal Power in Europe, to engage also in a civil war at home for the question of reform in Parliament. These considerations would now press on his mind, because he had seen what the Government had attempted, and also that they were not even at present fully aware of the importance of having recourse to all their resources for the purpose of putting an end to the war. Although the Government had called on Parliament and on the people for these large supplies, they had as yet neglected to avail themselves of other means in their power of distressing the enemy. That question had been brought before the House of Commons, and it had been mentioned in their Lordships' House, but he could not consider that it had had a fair consideration or deliberation by the limited number of noble Lords who had attended on that occasion. His belief was, that in addition to those resources in our own country which we had drawn upon, we should have directed our attention to the stoppage of the commerce of Russia. He trusted that an opportunity would be afforded for entering fully into that subject, and he would put a notice on their Lordships' books when he would draw attention to the question of vigorously arresting Russian commerce. Having now shadowed out some of the main objections entertained to this loan, and in doing so discharged what he felt to be a duty, he would not trespass further on the attention of their Lordships, but would conclude by thanking them for the indulgence which they had extended to him.

Bill read 2a; Committee negatived; and Bill to be read 3a To-morrow.