The Earl of Winchilsea, in presenting twenty-five petitions against the grant to Maynooth, said, he wished to explain some observations which he had been stated to have made use of—and which were reported to have given pain — with reference to a right hon. Gentleman (Mr. Gladstone), for whom he entertained the highest possible respect. He could not exactly remember the very words used, and he had been too much occupied to look at any report of them. The fact was, that he never wrote his speeches; for, once he did so, and he got into such confusion that he resolved never to do it again, but was determined to let his mouth speak what his heart felt. Sometimes, however, his heart was so full, that his mouth could not give utterance to his sentiments. But, with reference to the matter in hand, he did not think that he had made use of the words that were attributed to him. It had been represented that he (the Earl of Winchilsea) had charged the right hon. Gentleman with dishonesty. He could most conscientiously say that such an idea had never passed through his mind. He had merely, in what he said, alluded to the arguments in the recent speech of the right hon. Gentleman on the subject of the Maynooth grant. The word 'insidious,' as applied to the right hon. Gentleman's speech, he never had used, although he certainly had said that he did consider some of its arguments to be 'Jesuitical.' He repeated that of the right hon. Gentleman he had the highest opinion. A more honourable and higher minded gentleman did not exist; and it would pain him (the Earl of Winchilsea) exceedingly if anything that fell from him on that occasion should give him pain.
§ The Marquess of Breadalbane, having presented several petitions against the proposed endowment of Maynooth, said, he wished to take that opportunity of making a few observations in regard to a statement made by the noble Lord the Secretary for the Colonies (Lord Stanley), during the 123 debate of the previous night, as to the character of the numerous petitions which had been presented against the Government measure. The noble Lord had said that there was in fact a regular manufactory for these petitions; that they were got up for the occasion; that they did not express the spontaneous flow of the feelings of the people on the subject of Maynooth, and were therefore not entitled to any value. All he could say in regard to the petitions he had presented—and he had presented no inconsiderable number—was, that the circumstances stated by the noble Lord did not apply to them. He must, at the same time, be allowed to observe that, unless they were well founded, he thought such statements, in regard to the petitions presented to their Lordships, ought not to be made, especially in regard to a subject of legislation calculated to excite the deepest and strongest feelings of the people of this country.
Lord Stanley, after the remarks of the noble Lord, thought it right to correct a misapprehension under which the noble Lord appeared to labour, as to what he had really said on the occasion referred to. He did not attempt to detract from the value of the petitions presented against the Maynooth Bill. What he did was to divide them into classes; and he said that many of them came from those who wished to withdraw all support on the part of the State from any religion whatsoever—that there were many more which he could hardly regard as the genuine voice of the feelings of the people which they purported to express, for he knew the manner in which they had been got up—that he had himself seen many of them all couched in the same terms, and he had reason to believe that they had all come from the same place—and that there were many more that had emanated from the conscientious religious feelings of the petitioners, but which proceeded from an erroneous view of the measure brought forward by the Government; and he had also added that their Lordships, in dealing with those petitions, were bound to consider the soundness of the arguments they adduced, as well as the number of the petitions themselves.